RedWirez mixIR - Tube Power Amp Filter?

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by eriwebnerr, Apr 29, 2015.

  1. eriwebnerr

    eriwebnerr Member

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    I have some RedWirez IRs already, thinking of getting more for use with the Amplifire. I like that they have the mixIR online so you can blend several IRs into one easily.

    What I'm wondering about is their IRs that they have the "Tube Power Amp Filter" as an option to mix in your IRs. From what I can tell this mixes in their Speaker Impedance Curves in with standard cabinet IRs.

    This is what they say about these curves on their site:
    This update includes impulse responses of multiple speakers' impedance curves. These can be used to reproduce the effect that a tube amp can have on the frequency response of the speaker. Compared to solid-state power amps, tube amps have a high output impedance. As a result the connected speaker's frequency response will change, causing it to look more like it's impedance curve than when driven by a solid-state power amp. You may appreciate the more scooped tone, the added thump and sparkle.

    Has anyone used these curves along with traditional cab IRs? Do they add anything good to the mix? I'm thinking it might be redundant with the power amp sim already on the Amplifire - thoughts?
     
  2. djd100

    djd100 Member

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    Yes and yes. They typically scoop the mids a bit depending on their mix percentage factor.

    I have not tried them with a Amplifire however, just tube preamps. I used two Axe FX cab sims in series, one for the impedance curve and one for the cab IR.

    Try them yourself to see if they work for you.
     
  3. eriwebnerr

    eriwebnerr Member

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    Yah will definitely give it a shot. I figure I'll start with the Celestion Blue with a Vox since I own those. But it sounds like your saying it generally imparts what sounds like a more scooped EQ not necessarily an improved character on the cabinet piece of the tone puzzle.

    I am noticing that most of their highest rated tones on the site don't include this parameter. I'll try a few different "blends" and see what I get.

    Interested in any other thoughts as well ..
     
  4. djd100

    djd100 Member

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    They impart a more accurate representation of the speaker in question being used with a tube power amp. Whether that "improves" your desired target tonality is subjective of course.


     
  5. Axisman5150

    Axisman5150 Member

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    That's an interesting idea, I'll have to try that.
    I've been using the Redwirez mixIR plugin using those impedance curves mixed in around 50-60% and it does help in the "feel" department too. Since revisiting my Redwirez collection, I'm finding I like them more than the Ownhammers Lately. Nice to have a variety.
     
  6. Jay Mitchell

    Jay Mitchell Member

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    It is not possible to capture the effect of speaker impedance on the sound of a tube amp in an impulse response. There are two primary reasons for this:

    1. The source (output) impedance of the target (virtual) amp varies from amp to amp. This means that you can't even account for the linear effects of speaker impedance on the sound in an IR, and the nonlinear effects can be at least as great.

    2. The topology of the virtual amplifier's output stage, which also varies from amp to amp, profoundly affects how it interacts with the speaker's impedance. The interactions include both linear (frequency response) and nojnlinear (distortion) effects and can only be modeled accurately in the amp block of a modeler.

    3. The modelers with which I have some familiarity - Axe-Fx (both generations) and Amplifire - model the effects of speaker impedance in the amp block. With either of these modelers (and possibly others), attempting to account for this effect by modifying the speaker IR is therefore redundant. Even if an IR could accurately capture the effect, there is no need for it to do so.
     
  7. nicolasrivera

    nicolasrivera Silver Supporting Member

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    Useless, you or your mixing guys will use Eqs to set you up better in the mix!

    even with an IR filter you are not getting an accurate 100% certainty of filtering what ever that IR is filtering
     
  8. djd100

    djd100 Member

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    All true. I briefly used them with tube preamps DI'd (no tube power amp sim), and with tube preamps via solid state power amps with guitar cabs. They did help the realism factor in these scenarios IMO.

    Not sure how Redwirez did them, but perhaps they compared IR's of a speaker/cab with a tube power amp and a solid state power amp, and extrapolated some varied curves from the differences (they call them 50%, 60% etc thru 100% for some different speaker/cabs as I remember)?

    Once the Two Notes Torpedo came out I haven't needed them any more as the Torpedos have nice modeled tube power amp sims along with the rest of their features.

    Essentially the Redwirez Imp Curves are various mid-scooped EQ curves so they can be useful in that regard if you like the sound of them with your rig (they're free I believe so try them out if they sound at all interesting?).

     

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