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Reverb Tank cardboard... no, not kidding

Figaro

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
12,445
A metal reverb tank definitely picks up vibrations in a combo amp and this can affect the reverb sound. It seems that Leo Fender decided to spend the extra money to isolate the reverb tank with a cover and cardboard in his amps for a reason.
 

cap47

Member
Messages
2,270
I use ebony for best tone and sometimes 4 ply grenadine and I also properly intonate my springs. It is also best to match compression rate of the rubber spacers. You need to buy a special matcher for this that has been calibrated and verified accurate (watch ebay).
 

phsyconoodler

Member
Messages
4,315
OMG! You guys are so closed minded! Rattling springs = unwanted noise.Put the tank in a padded bag= less noise.Good dog.
Earlier Fender's had wood under the tanks that was spaced a 1/4 away with small wood spacer strips and the tank was screwed onto that and the put in a padded bag.
Friggin' try it already and then comment.
 

cap47

Member
Messages
2,270
OMG! You guys are so closed minded! Rattling springs = unwanted noise.Put the tank in a padded bag= less noise.Good dog.
Earlier Fender's had wood under the tanks that was spaced a 1/4 away with small wood spacer strips and the tank was screwed onto that and the put in a padded bag.
Friggin' try it already and then comment.
Sorry Phsyco, I didn't mean to make you go phsyco! I was just having a little fun with the subject. Of course it makes a difference when isolating the unit from the exterior vibrations good or bad. It does nothing to dampen the magnetic fields. My amps all have Bags and cardboard inside under the springs. I suppose I might try your suggestion at a time I am not feeling lazy!
 

bob-i

Member
Messages
8,776
OMG! You guys are so closed minded! Rattling springs = unwanted noise.Put the tank in a padded bag= less noise.Good dog.
Earlier Fender's had wood under the tanks that was spaced a 1/4 away with small wood spacer strips and the tank was screwed onto that and the put in a padded bag.
Friggin' try it already and then comment.
Jeez, calm down you'll blow a nut.

People are entitled to their opinions, no matter how wrong it is.
 

Wag

Member
Messages
456
A nearly word-for-word transcription of a conversation I had last weekend.

"Hey dude."
"Yeah?"
"Should I replace the cardboard sheet under the reverb tank of my (combo amp)?"
"What?"
"You know, that piece of cardboard under the reverb tank...? You know what I mean?"
"Oh... oh yeah. Okay. What? Why would you want to do that?"
"I want better reverb."
"What's wrong with the reverb?"
"I don't know... I just think it would be better."
(sigh)
"I guess that's a no?"
"No, no, no, no. The cardboard doesn't do anything but protect the open side of the reverb tank. You can use wood, metal, plastic, cardboard... whateva."
"But will it sound better with real wood?"
"You're kidding me, right?"
"No, I don't think so."
"You're stoned again, aren't you?"
"Nah man... well, kind of."

Please tell me I'm right.

This is freaking me out. Seriously. I had this SAME EXACT conversation with a dude. Except...




um.....it wasn't last weekend, it was last 1978.






um.......I wouldn't have been you, I think I was the dude.







and......ah........it wasn't a reverb tank, it was a dime of reefer.








cardboard? mmmmmm, no wait.......it wasn't....um......it was ....um........a paper wrapper of some type from a feminine hygiene gadget.






oh yea....and I remember, I was stoned too! Wow!!! How weird is that?

Man, I'm glad those days are behind me.
 

Sweetfinger

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
12,224
Eh, I just use old Valco made amps where the reverb tank itself is made of cardboard!
 

colinesquire

Member
Messages
1,121
I have a 74 dr that i took the cardboard out. I did some mods to increase the depth and the springs were actually slapping against the cardboard. I added some rubber feet to the tank to get more height and put it back in the bag. Works great now. The cardboard is there to protect and dampens the signal. The bag is needed or you'll get feedback and vibrations from the proximity to the speaker.
 

markmantle

Member
Messages
391
I can verify that cardboard works very well. I recently put together a princeton kit and noticed that the reverb was less than stellar. It sounded pretty weak, was feeding back at high levels and also had a slight distortion to it. I thought something was wrong with a tube, transformer, circuit or the tank. I took it out today, out if the bag and it sounded great... I realised that the bag must have been dampening the springs somehow. I zip locked the reverb tank to a piece of cardboard and then placed it back and the bag and into the amp and now it sounds great!

I actually just googled to see if anyone experienced this before and I found this tread... I must admit, my first thought was to go out and by a nice piece of wood to mount the tank to, but in the end, the cardboard is fine.
 

JackStraw12

Member
Messages
4,729
Necrothread. I have an old Hammond tank in my PR cline that's extremely sensitive. Cardboard better the wood and tank. Would a bag make a difference?
 

kinmike

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,793
My '64 Ampeg Echotwin reverb is lusher than a Fender and has no bag or cardboard. It is not transformer driven. Does that have anything to do with it?

Mike
 
Messages
1,347
As silly as it sounds, the cardboard does change the sound of the reverb. Better or worse is subjective.

I noticed it for the first time when I was working on a hot rod deluxe and had the chassis out and on a chassis stand. I pulled the reverb tank to test it and I thought it was terrible, a huge sprong, and tinny decay. When I put everything back together the reverb was far better. So I played with location and mounting and determined the cardboard helped in this case.

After that I put the tank in my Princeton like build on cardboard and blah, it sounded dead and lifeless. Mounted it back on the wood and it came back to life.

YMMV
It sounds more like you encountered an impedance mismatch issue. A hot rod deluxe reverb tank is not designed to work with a princeton type circuit, at least not very well. That's why it's important to check the recommended replacement tank spec when replacing a bad tank. Just my 2c.
 

bob-i

Member
Messages
8,776
It sounds more like you encountered an impedance mismatch issue. A hot rod deluxe reverb tank is not designed to work with a princeton type circuit, at least not very well. That's why it's important to check the recommended replacement tank spec when replacing a bad tank. Just my 2c.
No, not the same tank. I'm well aware of impedance requirements. The HRD tank sounded bad to my ears without the cardboard, the Princeton tank sounded bad to my ears with it. The rules are, there are no rules.
 

Jeff Gehring

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
5,806
My '64 Ampeg Echotwin reverb is lusher than a Fender and has no bag or cardboard. It is not transformer driven. Does that have anything to do with it?
An ET-1 Echotwin? Super cool amp! If that is what it is, though, it is in fact transformer coupled reverb. Just not the transformer you were expecting! It uses the OT for one half of the amp to drive that side's speaker AND the reverb tank input. I've got an ET-2 that I love, that is the same animal as the ET-1 basically, but with a few minor changes. I think the Echotwins are among the coolest, oddest amps Ampeg ever put out.

I think the goal of the cardboard bottom on the Fender tanks is just to prevent the possibility of the bag from pooching up and contacting the springs. That and spacing the springs up a 1/4" so they wouldn't slap against the cab so hard during transport.
 

Multicellular

Member
Messages
7,884
The cardboard actually does matter! Vibrations can transfer from the cabinet to the springs. I had an issue with an amp doing this at high volumes, but only on certain notes. No subjective better or worse, it was a problem. A double layer of vinyl fixed it.

But actually I didnt notice any difference at low volumes.
 




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