Selling a guitar you just bought new, and losing money on it, instead of just returning it?

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by Noise Under The Floor, Aug 12, 2019 at 10:37 PM.

  1. Noise Under The Floor

    Noise Under The Floor Silver Supporting Member

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    That’s not what I’m talking about though. I’m talking big name retailers, MF, GC, Sweetwater... people stating they “just bought” it from one of those places, and are supposedly well within the return window if what they’re saying is true.
     
  2. Silent Sound

    Silent Sound Member

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    I have a couple of rich friends. That kind of money doesn't mean much to them. It's like if I buy a gallon of milk and I come home and realize it's already spoiled. I'll just throw it away rather than having to deal with a return. To me, $5 isn't a lot. To them, $500 isn't a lot, and probably isn't worth the confrontation. And often, if they've returned something before, it's not worth the risk of being known as the guy (or gal) who's always returning things.

    Being rich is as much a lifestyle as it is a financial condition. There's a lot of socializing and concern with reputation among the rich. It's not unlike high school.
     
  3. big mike

    big mike Plexi Loving Admin Staff Member

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    Sometimes you can wear out your 'return' with those guys if you do it a lot.

    Especially if you got a special deal or closeout on something. I've seen that happen. Especially weith the sales engineers at some of the places.
    'OK I can get it to you for X delivered, but you can't return it.'

    Sometimes they're fishing for trades.
     
  4. Noise Under The Floor

    Noise Under The Floor Silver Supporting Member

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    Could be, considering all the guitars I’ve seen for sale involving this are higher end.
     
  5. cutaway

    cutaway Supporting Member

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    $5 is a lot to me and I live a mile from the store. I return stuff all the time. My family does ok, but a dollar is a dollar.
     
  6. derekd

    derekd Supporting Member

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    I think the poster was thinking more globally than this thread, but I'm with you, hence my snarky reply.
     
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  7. FlamesAreWicked

    FlamesAreWicked Supporting Member

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    I’ve wondered the same myself quite a few times... but there was one instance on social media where a guy had a classified ad for a guitar he hadn’t even bought yet... he was offering to order a guitar for someone and sell it at a discounted price....

    He used photos I posted on a different site for my own NGD for his ad...


    pretty messed up if you ask me...

    Check this thread out

    https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/shady-people-i-tell-ya.1999167/
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019 at 10:28 AM
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  8. eriwebnerr

    eriwebnerr Member

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    Sorry if it's already been said but another guess for someone doing this is that they have already bought and returned a ton of gear and they are afraid if getting blacklisted?
     
  9. whatizitman

    whatizitman Member

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    Soooooo..... yeah on the big idiots theory.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019 at 10:22 AM
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  10. Boris Bubbanov

    Boris Bubbanov Member

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    Rich ones often donate the guitar away, or they trade it. A few hire someone to sell 20 or so (guitars, cars, motorcycles) so they can have the fun of buying some "new" ones. What rich people often have in common is, a more refined sense of how much an item will sell for - if they want it sold it will go away. Their time is more important, they figure. I don't mean any offense to anyone, but if a guy is being super aggressive about getting top dollar for a typical guitar (certainly no more than $ 5,000), that's because money means more to him, than time. A truly rich guy will sweat over how much he gets for a 3 Million dollar house, but not something trivial like a replaceable guitar.
     
  11. whatizitman

    whatizitman Member

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    So, basically someone to avoid a sales transaction with at all costs. Gotcha.
     
  12. Boris Bubbanov

    Boris Bubbanov Member

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    Hmm. Maybe check the UCC.

    But I don't think GC or Sam Ash worry about sold on credit guitars as collateral. Too much trouble for such insignificant collateral. Maybe the main advantage is when a loan is secured by a pledge, it can extend the Statute of Limitations and that would be maybe good for them. But this is a bit like Shoplifting. They just factor in a certain amount of it - they accept some as inevitable.

    The main reason the Lender tries to retrieve no-pay Nissan Versas and Hyundai Accents is, not that there's any value there, but to send a message to would be scammers. These vehicles are sometimes not welcome at the bigger Auctions because nobody who shows up there has time for that.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019 at 10:33 AM
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  13. Boris Bubbanov

    Boris Bubbanov Member

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    Yup and sometimes, the seller has in fact paid LESS than the amount he is asking for. Just because Middle Class Fred would pay XXXX for this guitar, does not mean that someone else didn't maybe paid XXX. And it doesn't even have to be illegal or even sketchy. And maybe that someone doesn't actually want what he's agreeing to accept - but he wants the value locked up in it, or as much as can be unlocked easily.

    I had a new kayak I was desperate to get rid of (awful, awful color) but the manufacturer was a friend of mine, this eccentric Czech emigre and I knew I couldn't return it (a color blind buddy had done me no favors and had picked it up for me). Well, I traded that one elsewhere for one I couldn't really fit in. And that one I in turn traded for a used kayak I still have. The price on the "used" one, in the marketplace was about equal to a what Vladimir let me have the factory fresh Lilac one for.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019 at 10:50 AM
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  14. philiprst

    philiprst Supporting Member

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    Good question. I'm out of town for periods of time and can't take guitars with me, have other work and family obligations. I do quite a bit of recording so how a guitar records is quite important to me and I have to find the time to do that. I think there is also a honeymoon period with any instrument when it is appealing because it is different and after a while that settles down.
     
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  15. big mike

    big mike Plexi Loving Admin Staff Member

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    Yep. If It's in my budget to buy a few guitars a quarter...10-12K say. And I get a great deal, cost average, and my pricing is good because I spend so much, returns aren't going to be considered.

    I can also likely sell for a good deal, and still break even or close enough and maintain my 'status' with my product engineer.

    (**I in no way refers to me. I don't run in those circles. LOL)
     
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  16. stratzrus

    stratzrus Philadelphia Jazz, Funk, and R&B Supporting Member

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    I was in a similar situation. I bought an American Elite Telecaster and a couple of months later bought an American Elite Stratocaster. I'm more of a Strat guy so I thought about selling the Tele.

    The 45 day return date had just passed but I had gotten a very good deal on it and was probably facing an "only" $200 hit on it.

    I was all prepared to sell it but decided to play it one last time before boxing it up. Big mistake. I liked it so much that I decided to keep it but I could've been one of those people the OP was describing.
     
  17. d'djembe mutombo

    d'djembe mutombo Member

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    I've never done payment plans on music gear, but I imagine it's like any other financing and requires a contract. However, these financing plans aren't through the seller. They are through a 3rd party. So honestly, the seller could care less if you sell the gear and never pay another dime towards the plan. It is the lenders liability. They could attempt to repo the item, but they will probably submit it to debt collection. You can only default a couple times before no one will lend you money any more.

    Sure there people out there trying to scam the financing system, but they are a minority. If it was a real problem, interest rates would skyrocket.
     
  18. RayRay

    RayRay Silver Supporting Member

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    Here’s a case in point.

    I bought an HX Effects at guitar center, for pickup. guitar center is 30 mins away from me, but I wanted it that day to try with my PT15 IR. I liked it, didn’t love it (no fault of the unit... just me). Decided to go with Fractal FX8.

    Here’s the problem. I don’t feel like driving 30 minutes completely out of my way to return it. And I probably missed the window by now.

    Soooooo I have a brand new HXFX sitting in my home office. In the box.

    So there’s an example for ya.


    On a brighter, more useful note, I’ll probably set it up for looping for my daughter. She’s amazing.
     
  19. fjrabon

    fjrabon Member

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    I wouldn’t classify trading in a guitar at guitar center as “being bad with money” it’s realizing that 40% of the sale price isn’t a bad fee for not having to solicit a sale and worrying about things going south on a deal.

    I hate selling gear to people. Every day in here there’s some ******** thread about “there’s a couple of swirl marks and he classified this as excellent condition!” With like 10 responses saying “it’s not a big deal, but if it bothers you, ask for a return or some money back.”

    With guitar center I just take the thing in, usually trade it for something else I like at 60% of market value and I’m done. I make $100 an hour at work, and doing gear deals is something I actually like less than my actual job. It’s going to need to be worth thousands of dollars for me to do that vs just driving the thing over to guitar center.
     
  20. fjrabon

    fjrabon Member

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    Regarding the whole “is it illegal to sell a guitar you are making payments on” question:

    I’d say in 99.99999999% of cases, no. You’re getting a standard consumer loan with no collateral. Unless you bought it as “rent to own” then the moment you process the payment with the seller, it’s yours in full. You owe the credit company the same way you’d owe them on, for example, a payday loan. Their only real recourse is sending it to collections and nailing your credit if you don’t pay. Heck, you couldn’t even offer them the guitar to settle the debt, even if you wanted to.
     
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