Sharing gig experience with Torpedo CAB, Line6 X3 and real Amp...

nicolasrivera

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
6,740
This weekend i had a gig where i was invited to play 3 songs in a concert dedicated to Argentinian master composer Luis Alberto Spinetta and it was an honor because he, in latin America, is regarded as one of the most creative composers.

Any ways, for this gig i decided to use my Mesa 5:50+, the Torpedo CAB and my trusty Line6 X3.

The mesa provided the clean and dirty sounds and it serve me as my sound monitor only, no mics in front of it. Using the FX loop i send the signal to the Torpedo CAB that took care of the Cabinet simulation, from there the signal went into the Line6 X3 that took care of Delays, Choruses and compression, from there 2 signals came out, one to the house mixer and the other to my Mesa's FX return.

This was a very nice setup tone wise because i got inspired by my sound and what came out from the PA was amazing! Lots of complements after the show ended!. And what got the most attention was the Torpedo CAB, everybody knew the X3 from shape and color, but no one could tell what that little white pedal did.

 

CheeseGrater

Member
Messages
709
Nice! Sounds like a good setup.

I love having my own separate stage volume amp that i can control myself and isn't coming from some monitor speaker that's ear piercing. Like you say it is much more inspiring playing when hearing your tone loud and clear as you intend it to sound. I use a stereo setup for this - one cab mic'd for PA, the other cab is all mine!
 

Ringleader42

Member
Messages
1,387
Cool, but not seeing the logic of spending $500 on something where a $80 SM57 would do the job.

I could see spending the money on a torpedo cab if you are running IEMs or direct to a personal monitor where YOU can hear the benefits, but since you are only sending the Torpedo signal to FOH and monitoring via your mesa cab, why not just mic the amp?

Or wait, are you hearing the cab sim'd signal from the Torpedo through your mesa cab too?
 
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JohnB

Member
Messages
306
i'm doing a similar deal with an x3 using the inbuilt cabs, because soundman doesnt want to mike the cab. :dunno return has the cab sim off (somewhat). combo amp is setup like a personal monitor & i'm able to control the stage vol without impacting the house send. i would like to try the forthcoming sd amplifire in that config as well to get the better IR possibilities. i'd imagine this is fairly common in 4cm setups with x3s
 

nicolasrivera

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
6,740
Cool, but not seeing the logic of spending $500 on something where a $80 SM57 would do the job.

I could see spending the money on a torpedo cab if you are running IEMs or direct to a personal monitor where YOU can hear the benefits, but since you are only sending the Torpedo signal to FOH and monitoring via your mesa cab, why not just mic the amp?
Well, with a SM57 in from of the cone's speaker in a live gig you could set it to about 4 or 5 usable positions and you are constrained to the sound of that speaker and cabinet. Now, with the Torpedo CAB in the FX loop you can get a hell of lot more microphones, speakers and cabinets, you will be surprise just how that much more versatile your amp becomes!.
Until you don't try one with your real amp you will just not perceive its full potential, and i didn't buy it for that, its more for recording and stuff to make my studio workflow easier, but you can get extremely creative with the unit.

The Torpedo CAB is such an useful and fun unit to use that you will just feel its money well spent... and i bought it used for $400.
 

Ringleader42

Member
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1,387
I edited my post but probably should have just posted another response:

Are you hearing the cab sim'd signal from the Torpedo through your mesa cab too? And how are you switching everything (effects on X3 and presets on torpedo)?
 

shredmiyagi

Member
Messages
1,216
The CAB seems like a great design. I wanted an IR/cab pedal for years, ever since I discovered what an IR was, but I'm already committed to the Axe-FX, so what's the point?

I'd like to trial it with a Zoom MS50 though, see how that sounds compared to the Axe. So much nicer to just carry a pedal board (vs. a heavy rack + controller)...
 

Alter

Member
Messages
769
seems to work, but are you sure that what the house hears is of equal quality to what YOU hear on stage? Meaning that you hear and feel the mesa power section and speakers, but the audience gets the preamp only, plus the simulation.. Just asking (i like the boogies, have had a few and kept a studio 22+ the longest, and also have a pod myself - but prefer the feel of a tech 21 blonde + pedals for live)..
 

Ringleader42

Member
Messages
1,387
The reason I ask is this... It is my understanding that it always boils down to the same limitation with these types of devices (HD500, RP1000, Torpedo CAB, etc.). You can't use said device as a cranked poweramp only modeler (no cab sim included) in the loop of your head/combo while also sending a cab sim'd signal to FOH or IEMs. Or did you find a way to do this?
 

Baba

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
7,341
I edited my post but probably should have just posted another response:

Are you hearing the cab sim'd signal from the Torpedo through your mesa cab too? And how are you switching everything (effects on X3 and presets on torpedo)?
I'd like to know this as well, because, theoretically, if you're running the Torpedo into the Boogie, you're running an already mic'd/cab sim'd tone, into an amplifier that will then give it's own amp/cab/speaker tone on top of that, which, theoretically, you wouldn't want.

Or, if you're running the Torpedo to FoH only, and using the amp how it's designed, then you really aren't hearing the benefits of the Torpedo, only the audience is.
 

heretic

Member
Messages
806
I think the OP might be seeing if you guys are on your toes today....
+1

Seems like the POD and TCAB should be reversed in the diagram above.

Mesa Pre > POD > Left side to Amp return
-=========--> Right side to TCAB> FOH

But hey, if it works for Nicolas, rock on hermano! :dude
 

nicolasrivera

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
6,740
I edited my post but probably should have just posted another response:

Are you hearing the cab sim'd signal from the Torpedo through your mesa cab too? And how are you switching everything (effects on X3 and presets on torpedo)?
The reason I ask is this... It is my understanding that it always boils down to the same limitation with these types of devices (HD500, RP1000, Torpedo CAB, etc.). You can't use said device as a cranked poweramp only modeler (no cab sim included) in the loop of your head/combo while also sending a cab sim'd signal to FOH or IEMs. Or did you find a way to do this?
+1

Seems like the POD and TCAB should be reversed in the diagram above.

Mesa Pre > POD > Left side to Amp return
-=========--> Right side to TCAB> FOH

But hey, if it works for Nicolas, rock on hermano! :dude
Ok guys let me tell you what is happening here, in the wide body Mesa cab i put a Line6 Celestion Speaker that came with my Flextone XL amp, from Line 6. I know the sound of this speakers very well, i bought the flex tone around 2003.

You know when they say that a Cab is just as an instrument as a guitar, well it is true because this L6 Celestion speaker sounds so much better in this cab then in the Flextone combo. The mesa cab rings deep like an acoustic guitar does when tapped.

Now you know the Speaker on the cabinet, now lets talk about the head, the 5:50+. As you my guess the head is split in half with my setup, the preamp section of the head serves as the tone generator and the power amp section serves as a Tube power amp section switchable between 50W,25W or 5Watts making it extremely useful and versatile.

Now the Torpedo CAB, this unit serves as the coloration of the tone generator (amp Head), in it i use the power amp simulation, then i use mostly the Red Wires cabinet IRs, more on this later. And when needed i use the EQ section.

And now the POD X3, this one serves for creating space and modulations and sometimes compression.

Now lets talk why i like having the X3 in the final position. I just like hearing the full amp tone with in the reverb and delay! With a chorus is just sounds wider this way and you have the advantage to send a Stereo feed to FOH. The pod is ONLY doing this tasks nothing else. The master volume is now the master volume for the Mesa Power Amp section.

When you insert a cable on the RETURN plug of the FX loop it defeats the master volume on the amp they become now the volume feed for the SEND plug, if you have the Head set for 50 watts you can push it hard by turning the Master Volume on the POD, it pushed the tube in the FX loop really nice.

With in the Torpedo CAB you have 2 effective OUTS, the Output line and the headphone line and with in the POD X3 you have 6 effective outputs, 2 digital, Left and right outputs and the stereo headphones. With all this outputs you can get really creative in your routing, i just use it the simple way.

From the headphone out of the Torpedo CAB i could effectively feed a second FX unit of Amp head that WILL NOT be affected by the POD, this is great for recording the pure tone of the amp and cab simulation with out any FXs.

Since the POD X3 has 2 true effective independent signal chains you can feed the guitar input on the X3 with the Output line of the TPCAB and the Mic in of the X3 with the headphone out of the TPCAB and inside the POD you just pan hard left and hard right to split both chains in two, this will give you really powerful mixing options sending dual FX, delays, Reverbs etc and mixing them with in the console of the house or recorder...

Thats why i really find the X3 to be easier and more versatile then the HD.

So, it boils down to why the hell do i want to hear a simulation coming out from a real cabinet right? well its simple, because its sounds GREAT!, not all IRs sound great in this set up, but you get 512 IR slots with in the TPCAB and the Red Wires IR library has almost any cabinet sound you could possibly want if you take your time to find it, Torpedo cab makes it easier then any other Hardware or software base IR housting.

The Celestion Line 6 speaker does not color the sound that much so it serves me very well for hearing good tones in the direct line and whats coming out of the real cabinet.

Hope this clears a bit of your questions.
 
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marty51

Member
Messages
242
i found the best config without amp , a full tube preamp in torpedo cab .
I 've tried a lot of preamp fet and tube and Fredamp made the best .

I use crystal preamp based on fender twin
JTBass preamp based on jtm45 and bassman
fmp100 based on plexi 100
a pic of my pedalboard



FredAmp family


http://www.fredamp.aisentreprise.fr/

and some videos in different styles







 

djd100

Member
Messages
3,076
Sure you can as all three components of the Torpedo CAB/LIVE are individually selectable (tube power amp sim, cab/mic sim, EQ).

The Torpedo works incredibly well as a tube power amp sim only with guitar cabs, and gives you great tube power amp color at any volume with any amp.

The reason I ask is this... It is my understanding that it always boils down to the same limitation with these types of devices (HD500, RP1000, Torpedo CAB, etc.). You can't use said device as a cranked poweramp only modeler (no cab sim included) in the loop of your head/combo while also sending a cab sim'd signal to FOH or IEMs. Or did you find a way to do this?
 




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