Shiva vs Carr 6v

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by Neil, Dec 9, 2005.


  1. Neil

    Neil Member

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    Has anyone got both of these or a/b'd them?

    I have a Shiva which I like a lot and if it were the only amp in the world I would probably be happy but I can imagine how it can be improved. The clean channel isnt as alive (probably not a good adjective to use) as other clean channels (eg fender dual pro, fuchs tds) and the o/d channel could be more plexi like (eg ganesha). Overall it is more compressed than other amps I have.

    From what I have read the Carr 6v has a great clean and a very plexi like o/d channel. Is this true?

    I have searched the forum and not come up with any comparisons of these 2 amps which was a surprise as it seems they both have a similar design objective.


    Thanks in advance

    Neil
     
  2. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    Matt McCloskey can weigh in on this one.

    I had a Slant 6V 2x12 for about a year.......loved the clean channel, ambivalent about the gain channel unless it's really turned up loud (too loud for my two guitar drums bass rock band).
     
  3. Hipster Dofus

    Hipster Dofus Member

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    Quite awhile back, I had both. I switched the speakers for a few weeks even. I liked the Cleans of the Slant more. Cathode bias and cleans just do it for me. At the time I prolly liked the shiva gain better. The shiva has the ported cab that is real nice for a harder blues rock vibe. The slants open cab was more vintage. All IMHO.
     
  4. myles111

    myles111 Member

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    Neil,

    These amps are not the least bit alike in any way and I do not think their design objective was near the same.
     
  5. Neil

    Neil Member

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    Myles,

    Thanks for the input. My statement was based on them appearing to me to be footswitchable 2 channel combos with a fender like clean channel and a marshall like o/d channel.

    If I am wrong that's ok. I've been wrong before ("totally wrong" sometimes!) and I can guarantee I'll be wrong again. Soon.

    I should have simply asked :-

    I am looking for a foot switchable amp with more engaging cleans and more plexi like o/d than a Shiva 1x12. What can anyone recommend? Would the Carr 6v be a candidate?

    Neil
     
  6. ducmike

    ducmike Silver Supporting Member

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    I used to have an early 6v head. The clean side is the best I have heard. I liked the gain side, but it's not a plexi tone. It's smoother and higher gain. Steve has reworked the gain side on new 6v's though.
     
  7. mattmccloskey

    mattmccloskey Supporting Member

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    What? they are different in a number of ways but this statement is just bizarre, they have a whole bunch of things in common, if you compare the same configuration:
    They are both 2 channel amps available in a 1x12 combo format.
    Both amps have seperate tone stacks for clean and dirty.
    Both amps have footswitchable channels and gain boost.
    Both amps have an effects loop.
    Both amps have reverb.
    Both amps have a fendery clean channel, and a modded marshall-style lead channel, with master volume control.
    Both amps achieve gain by an overdriven pre-amp circuit.

    I have owned 2 slants and 3 shivas. With both I was setting them up for a clean fendery sound, a crunch tone on the gain side, and lead tone with boost engaged.
    As to the original question, the clean on the shiva is excellent with the 6l6 model. What tubes are in yours Neil? It really makes a difference, not only because of the tube type, but because the transformers are different as well, and few other circuit things.
    I think both amps are excellent. The shiva has a bigger sound due to the bigger, ported cab. It has more low end, and is tighter, because it is closed back as you know. If you A/B them the slant sounds boxier and less authoritative because of the smaller, open back cab. The price you pay is weight and portability-the slant is much easier to lift and carry.
    Both amps have a smooth overdrive, very much based in the marshall camp, but with more low-mids and less bite (although speaker choice has a lot to do here). The boost on both adds some gain, and a little volume, and also adds a bit of bite and sizzle. The carr boost is slightly hotter in the amount of added gain.
    In the clean department I like the slant more at low volumes or moderate volumes, because the open back gives it some air and it sounds more like a deluxe. However, at loud gig levels the shiva opens up a bit, and the closed back cab keeps it more focused and doesn't get lost in the mix. The carr is very loud, but doesn't keep the low end as controled as I like in that context.
    I found for the most part that I could get 'my sound' from both. The biggest difference is in the cabinet, speaker, and set up.
    In general, on gigs the shiva with reverb and 6l6 was more consistent from room to room (again largely because of power and cab design). The slant however sounded great too, and was much easier to carry and put in different spaces. The slant was also sweeter in the clean channel at low volume.
     
  8. mattmccloskey

    mattmccloskey Supporting Member

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    by the way, neil, I also don't think the shiva is any more compressed than the slant6v at all. Again, I am speaking of the 6l6 version. It seems more people hear the el34 model and have the critiques like yours. I think the difference is really substantial.
    I also don't think any higher gain preamp circuit will get very plexi-like. They always sound more processed. (not always a bad thing, just different).
     
  9. Plan9FOS

    Plan9FOS Member

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    My 2 cents ... the Shiva sounds best with a Strat style guitar. It can be dark with an LP or PRS guitar. It is perfection with a Strat that has a humbucker in the bridge.

    As far as clean tone, if you play funk, the Shiva rules. If you want a sweet sounding clean then the Carr is the best bet. I prefer the slightly drier sound of the Shiva clean channel when the amp is turned up, because it is percussive as all heck and is still easy to manage for leads and licks.

    IMO the Slant 6V gain channel does not cut through a mix in a band as well as the Shiva's. It sounds great, but it is much too dark. The 6V6 tubes get a bit mushier when driven, and I can still hear the effects of that in the Slant 6V. To each their own ... :BEER
     
  10. 1-Take-Wonder

    1-Take-Wonder Member

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    I remember Kendrick's second generation of amps (Gusher??) having a very nice fendery tweedy clean, and Plexi crunch when you opened it up. You could do it with your gtr volume, i dont remember if it had switchable channels.

    good luck finding one though...
     
  11. sws1

    sws1 Member

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    Whilte the Shiva has a very good clean, I don't think it sounds anything like a Fender. At least no Fender I've ever played or heard. I think, unfortunately, people use "Fender-y" to describe a good clean sound, even if it is not Fendery.
     
  12. JAH

    JAH Member

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    Ok this is a bit long but you asked…. My band is roots, blues, and some twangin honkey tonk (think Pete Anderson). Mostly Strat’s and Tele’s with Vintage output style pickups. I was a rocker in the 80’s and still like my gained out Marshall tones from time to time. The Shiva 1x12 combo(6L6) has come and gone(it is a great amp) but the 6V has been my regular gigging amp for over 4 years. In the 1x12 combo config the Bogner was a bigger sounding amp than the 6V. Its a different cab design (plus higher wattage) and puts out a chunk o sound. I still prefer the Carr clean in a combo but the Shiva in overdrive had more oomph.

    My problem with the Shiva was its “sweet spot” was always too loud. The eye opener was when I plugged the Carr into a G12H30 Anni loaded extension cab. It made a huge difference. I now run the Carr as a head with a 2x12(sometimes 1x12) cab loaded with a G12H30 Anni and either a Tone Tubby hemp alnico or well pounded in Vintage 30. I’ve got a couple cabs loaded with different speakers which I choose based on the size of the of the room we are playing.

    My Carr is a below 100 Ser. #, reverb on the drive channel, and a great effects loop. I updated the overdrive to the second most recent circuit and it made a difference. The beauty of this amp is its adaptability. Most gigs I run it at the 18w or 22w setting which really lets the amp sing. Either setting sounds huge with a 2x12. The clean channel puts my ’66 Pro Reverb back in the closet and takes pedals really well. With the two separate preamp sections (one for the clean, one for the OD) you can do all sorts of things with different preamp tubes to optimize the two channels to your taste. I’ll run different combinations of 5751’s and 12AX7’s on the boost channel depending what I’m going for. Also with a bias adjustment you can run 6L6’s in the fixed bias position. I’ve had a set of GE 6L6’s in mine for over two years and 90% of the time I’ll just run it on those.

    I’ve also had this amp long enough to really be able to dial it in for specific situations and guitars. I don’t need any pedals with it and a few times when I forgot the channel switching/boost pedal I just played through the boost channel all night with the amp set to clean up when I rolled back on my volume knob.

    The amp has been rock solid with only 1 of the original EH 6V6’s taking a dump after 3 years of hard gigging. I have it loaded with all sorts of NOS tubes now and that bumped it even higher on the tone scale for me. Finally Steve Carr has been great to communicate with and is very supportive of his products. Damn I liked the amp so much I bought a Double Slant 6 (80w) just for some extra HP if I need it. Now that thing is a beast…:Devil
     
  13. Neil

    Neil Member

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    Thanks for all the input. My Shiva is an EL34 version. I have listened to 6l6 versions in the store and it did seem the cleans were better but didnt get a chance to a/b the 2.

    I need to go and find a 6v locally and try it.

    Neil
     
  14. Tag

    Tag Gold Supporting Member

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    I would take the Carr, for a few reasons. I think the clean is warmer, and less sterile sounding. (The Shivas is nice though!) The Bogners low end will stay tighter, while the Carrs flubbed, so keep that in mind. Not a big deal if you are not going to be playing a lot of power chords. The Shivas overdrive would be better suited for harder rock IMO. Its tighter and more focused. More Marshally sounding to me, whre the Carrs was warmer and more Fendery sounding. (Better for blues and lower gain stuff.) Still has LOTS of drive on tap though. Both reverbs are nice!

    Both amps are great channel switchers, and its really a matter of what style you play more often.

    One other amp I think you should check out is the orange Rockerverb. GREAT amp, that does both things well, but has a voice all its own.
     
  15. Bo Faulkner

    Bo Faulkner Member

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    I agree with the guy who says they are not similar... really are apples and oranges.. The Carr is like the best deluxe reverb you can imagine with twice the headroom. The other channel is a bonus ... Hard to go wrong with the clean side and a nice pedal. The Bogner feels and acts more like a "high powered" amp where as the Carr feels and acts like a smallish bf fender (only with more volume)
     

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