Sparkly speakers for open-back 2x12" needed

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
Hey there,
so my rig is Tele -> bunch of dirt pedals and delays -> Acoustic 270 (solid state) -> Jet City 2x12".

Right now, there's a Celestion G12H-100 and a Celestion Classic Lead in the cab and it works out fine for dirt, but I'm increasingly playing clean and the clean sounds are a bit uninspiring tbh.

The Acoustic is a very "direct" amp that doesn't compress much until it's about to blow up (way too loud!) and the Celestions don't break up much at sane volumes. There's also some chime and sparkle missing in the top end. I do like the 270 a lot (probably the best "pedal amp" I know) and I don't have the funds to buy another amp at the moment, but I guess a speaker swap could get me closer to the desired sound.

So what would you recommend? Keep in mind the Acoustic is around 150 watts at 4 Ohm, so weak speakers are not a good choice. Currently looking at the Eminence Patriot line.
 

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
Bump.

Maybe the Patriots are not what I want. They all seem to have relatively warm treble and I need something to put some sparkle into the 270.
What about the Eminence Tonker? Sparkly enough?
 

swiveltung

Senior Member
Messages
14,485
Trying to remember what the Tonker sounded like to me. I'm thinking a bit scooped on the mids, big bottom and thin but clean highs with sizzle. Wow, I remember Acoustics being bright and clean. You want more sparkle? Is this a vintage Acoustic?
I'm thinking just a regular Emi Legend for clean and balance but will break up when pushed. Or the Weber 12F150, 150T or 12F125. ... progressively brighter in that list. The F150 has a nice mid range breakup when pushed. They take forever to break in though.
 

Figaro

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
13,016
Eminence Lil Texas Neo speaker. They have a full sound with the sparkle and are so much lighter than ceramic magnet speakers.
 
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schandmann

Member
Messages
21
Trying to remember what the Tonker sounded like to me. I'm thinking a bit scooped on the mids, big bottom and thin but clean highs with sizzle. Wow, I remember Acoustics being bright and clean. You want more sparkle? Is this a vintage Acoustic?
I'm thinking just a regular Emi Legend for clean and balance but will break up when pushed. Or the Weber 12F150, 150T or 12F125. ... progressively brighter in that list. The F150 has a nice mid range breakup when pushed. They take forever to break in though.
It's a 70s Acoustic. Lots of bass, flat mids and clear warm treble. I wouldn't call the amp bright, not hearing a lot of sparkle either. The cleans are servicable as is, but better treble extension and a bit more compression and/or speaker breakup would probably kick it up another notch.
What Legend would you recommend? Webers are expensive and rare here in Germany.

I'm thinking Vintage 30s.
Not a huge fan of the V30 sound and at 60 watts each they are a bit underpowered, but there's a closed-back 2x12" loaded with them at our practice space that I'll check out with my amp. We'll see.

Edit: Guinness Lad, why not keep the G12H-100? The CL and the G12H-100 sound very similar to me.
The Gold or the Anni are both low wattage..
 
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DaveKS

Member
Messages
16,704
I'll 2nd the Lil Texas neo. Probably 2 16ohm in parallel for 8ohm load.

But I'll also go with thought that there might be something else amiss here that's dragging your top end down. Usually people are wanting to know how to tame the brittle top end of that SS amp. And to me there's no shortage of top end in either of those speakers.

Have you ever had all the pots/EQ sliders of amp cleaned and relubed?

Also could be you've got high end tone loss in your signal chain before it ever reaches the amp. What does it sound like when you plug straight in with a short cable and bypass pedalboard? How long a cable do you use between guitar and 1st pedal? Between pedalboard and amp? Are any of your pedals buffered?

If your losing top end before it ever reaches speaker no amount of speaker swapping is going to restore it.
 

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
But I'll also go with thought that there might be something else amiss here that's dragging your top end down. Usually people are wanting to know how to tame the brittle top end of that SS amp. And to me there's no shortage of top end in either of those speakers.

Have you ever had all the pots/EQ sliders of amp cleaned and relubed?
The pots are fine, I can dial in a horrifically bright sound if I want to, but it goes from "a bit flat and uninspiring" to "oh **** let me grab my earplugs" with not much inbetween. I don't want more treble per se, I just want more sparkle. (Though I don't know exactly what that is. I'll know it when I hear it.)

For comparison, our other guitarplayer plays a stock Chinese-made Red Stripe Bandit and that thing can be gnarly if you are not careful with the treble pot. The Acoustic is much warmer.

Also could be you've got high end tone loss in your signal chain before it ever reaches the amp. What does it sound like when you plug straight in with a short cable and bypass pedalboard? How long a cable do you use between guitar and 1st pedal? Between pedalboard and amp? Are any of your pedals buffered?

If your losing top end before it ever reaches speaker no amount of speaker swapping is going to restore it.
Guitar -> first pedal is 3 or 4,5m, last pedal to amp is 6m. Some pedals are buffered, some are TB. Will check next time I'm at the practice space.
 

Guinness Lad

Senior Member
Messages
15,860
Edit: Guinness Lad, why not keep the G12H-100? The CL and the G12H-100 sound very similar to me.
The Gold or the Anni are both low wattage..
How many watts? The Gold is a 50 watt speaker. You could do the other as you said they are similar.
 

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
The Lil Texas is hard to find on the used market. I'm willing to lug a somewhat heavy 2x12" around - would the Texas Heat do as well?

Maybe I should just replace the amp. There's a few cheap solid state heads that have "spongier" cleans... Yamaha G100? Epi Triggerman? Peavey Supreme? idk.
 

Guinness Lad

Senior Member
Messages
15,860
The Texas Heat is a good speaker but I wouldn't call it sparkly. It has a high end chirp that can be a bit harsh, and teh midrange is recessed. When I think of sparkle I usually think alnico speakers or high midrange, not treble. I had both the Texas Heat and Lil Texas, they sounded the same to me.
 

swiveltung

Senior Member
Messages
14,485
It's a 70s Acoustic. Lots of bass, flat mids and clear warm treble. I wouldn't call the amp bright, not hearing a lot of sparkle either. The cleans are servicable as is, but better treble extension and a bit more compression and/or speaker breakup would probably kick it up another notch.
What Legend would you recommend? Webers are expensive and rare here in Germany.

Not a huge fan of the V30 sound and at 60 watts each they are a bit underpowered, but there's a closed-back 2x12" loaded with them at our practice space that I'll check out with my amp. We'll see.

Edit: Guinness Lad, why not keep the G12H-100? The CL and the G12H-100 sound very similar to me.
The Gold or the Anni are both low wattage..
Ohh... probably the 1218 maybe the 1258. They are brighter than the description implies. had 15" 1218 ina SS Gibson L series amp. Plenty of high spike on that with the right EQ.
 

DaveKS

Member
Messages
16,704
The pots are fine, I can dial in a horrifically bright sound if I want to, but it goes from "a bit flat and uninspiring" to "oh **** let me grab my earplugs" with not much inbetween. I don't want more treble per se, I just want more sparkle. (Though I don't know exactly what that is. I'll know it when I hear it.)
Well a EQ might be best thing for you, sparkle I'd put that at 2-3k, none of your amps EQ probably set right where you need them. My Rocket EQ is a wonder at that, you pick the freq and you also have control of how wide area around that freq center it effects. For this type of thing parametrics are where it's at. Graphic EQ you have no control of the centers or the slope around it.

The freq knob is sweepable from 60hz-6khz, Q knob controls slope. Keep Q narrow, almost stuck wah notch type thing, sweep freq around till you find that freq which adds your sparkle then widen up Q till it's effecting range you need.
 

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
Ohh... probably the 1218 maybe the 1258. They are brighter than the description implies. had 15" 1218 ina SS Gibson L series amp. Plenty of high spike on that with the right EQ.
These look promising, thanks. Shouldn't be too hard to find used either.

Well a EQ might be best thing for you, sparkle I'd put that at 2-3k, none of your amps EQ probably set right where you need them. My Rocket EQ is a wonder at that, you pick the freq and you also have control of how wide area around that freq center it effects. For this type of thing parametrics are where it's at. Graphic EQ you have no control of the centers or the slope around it.

The freq knob is sweepable from 60hz-6khz, Q knob controls slope. Keep Q narrow, almost stuck wah notch type thing, sweep freq around till you find that freq which adds your sparkle then widen up Q till it's effecting range you need.
Sounds clever, but I would rather solve the problem without having to buy another pedal. One less thing to worry about at a gig.
 

jads57

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
6,139
I use to use 2 x12" EV12L Avatar Traditional open back cab. But to lighten the weight I'm using 2 Warehouse Guitar Speakers Lead 80's in the same cab. Tried the Neo Jensens and Celestion GT-65 (Robben Ford)speakers, not enough clean headroom,bottom,etc.
 

schandmann

Member
Messages
21
I use to use 2 x12" EV12L Avatar Traditional open back cab. But to lighten the weight I'm using 2 Warehouse Guitar Speakers Lead 80's in the same cab. Tried the Neo Jensens and Celestion GT-65 (Robben Ford)speakers, not enough clean headroom,bottom,etc.
I'm using two speakers similar to the Lead 80 at the moment and would actually like less clean headroom/more speaker breakup/more compression.
 






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