Speaker Break-In

toddincharlotte

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,813
Any short cuts? I am super tired of listening the this fizz and distortion from my Weber FC12s. I have about 4 hours on them now but their tech said anywhere from 12-20 to fully break-in.

Don't care how it happens....just need to get rid of this fizz.
 

TimmyP

Member
Messages
2,485
Wire one of the speakers reverse polarity. Run a signal generator (free iPhone or Android app) into the amp and sweep the frequency to find the one that makes the least racquet (between 80Hz and maybe 400Hz). Assuming that the speakers can take the full power of the amp, crank it up until it clips, then back it down until it is clean again. Let it cook. When done, correct the speaker wiring.
 

teemuk

Member
Messages
3,180
Waste of effort.

Greatest percentage of "break-in" happens within the very first -seconds- of driving the speaker and flexing the coil. There will be minor changes in characteristics from there on but in practice those are comparable to effects of speaker simply warming up, and most likely entirely inaudible.

Don't believe the hype.
 

toddincharlotte

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,813
Waste of effort.

Greatest percentage of "break-in" happens within the very first -seconds- of driving the speaker and flexing the coil. There will be minor changes in characteristics from there on but in practice those are comparable to effects of speaker simply warming up, and most likely entirely inaudible.

Don't believe the hype.
Maybe true in some cases but in the case of this Weber I specifically talked to their tech team and they said 12 - 20 hours for break in. Based on the speakers current condition I don't even really want to play it....high end fizz, can post a demo later.
 

MKB

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
8,377
Waste of effort.

Greatest percentage of "break-in" happens within the very first -seconds- of driving the speaker and flexing the coil. There will be minor changes in characteristics from there on but in practice those are comparable to effects of speaker simply warming up, and most likely entirely inaudible.

Don't believe the hype.
I have to respectfully disagree. I have found that some speakers do not require break in, but Celestions certainly do. If a speaker sounds too trebly and harsh when it shouldn't, it may need break in. In fact the last two I broke in were Weber recones of a pair of Celestion Greenbacks. The two recones were in a cab with an original G12M-25 Blackback and a Greenback recone. Both of the non-recones sounded very good, with the blackback the best, however the reissue Greenback sounded somewhat muted in the highs compared with the blackback. The blackback was near perfect in tone. IMHO the perfect Greenback tone is bright with no harshness at all. They should take the edge off most any tone but still have presence.

I originally asked Weber to recone them as "from the factory" G12M-25's, which they did, but they sounded so harsh with some amps they were unusable. I suffered with this for several years (did not use the speakers very much in that time, maybe just a few hours) and went through a dialogue with Weber on the speakers.

I eventually put a Variac on one of the two recones (maybe 8VAC for 12 hours), and the improvement as compared to the non-broken in recone was astonishing. The harshness was gone, and it sounded very sweet. It sounded almost indistinguisable from the blackback after break in. I went back and forth between the speakers in comparison, leaving all in the cab but having only one connected at a time, to make as accurate a comparison as possible. The differences were very clear.

I then broke in the second recone, and it had the same improvements as the first recone. The cab now sounds great, and is usable with all of the amps it was previously unusable with.
 

toddincharlotte

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,813
I have to respectfully disagree. I have found that some speakers do not require break in, but Celestions certainly do. If a speaker sounds too trebly and harsh when it shouldn't, it may need break in. In fact the last two I broke in were Weber recones of a pair of Celestion Greenbacks. The two recones were in a cab with an original G12M-25 Blackback and a Greenback recone. Both of the non-recones sounded very good, with the blackback the best, however the reissue Greenback sounded somewhat muted in the highs compared with the blackback. The blackback was near perfect in tone. IMHO the perfect Greenback tone is bright with no harshness at all. They should take the edge off most any tone but still have presence.

I originally asked Weber to recone them as "from the factory" G12M-25's, which they did, but they sounded so harsh with some amps they were unusable. I suffered with this for several years (did not use the speakers very much in that time, maybe just a few hours) and went through a dialogue with Weber on the speakers.

I eventually put a Variac on one of the two recones (maybe 8VAC for 12 hours), and the improvement as compared to the non-broken in recone was astonishing. The harshness was gone, and it sounded very sweet. It sounded almost indistinguisable from the blackback after break in. I went back and forth between the speakers in comparison, leaving all in the cab but having only one connected at a time, to make as accurate a comparison as possible. The differences were very clear.

I then broke in the second recone, and it had the same improvements as the first recone. The cab now sounds great, and is usable with all of the amps it was previously unusable with.
Thanks. This is exactly where I'm at right now. Hoping the same story plays out for me and these Fane Crescendo clones.
 

sickboy79

Member
Messages
13,072
Play loud if you can. In my experience, playing breaks speakers in the best. Some speakers take more time than others.
 

Tone Meister

Member
Messages
3,268
That's a pretty heavy duty speaker. Aluminum dust cover, 100-watt coil, and 60-oz magnet. It's relatively simple to "play in" a 25 watt speaker, but a speaker this robust could use some vigorous exercise to get everything loosened up well enough to sound as intended.

https://www.tedweber.com/fc12f

There is good reason why Avatar, Scumback, and Weber offer speaker break-in services. Ask any of them and they'll give you those reasons, and it's mechanics 101, not voodoo science.
 
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Scumback Speakers

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
10,866
You'll need a good 18-24 hours on a variac (set properly to the right voltage) for M to H magnet speakers, and that will get it to 90-95%, typically. If you want to break in a speaker by playing, figure 20-30w of power and 50-60 hours. There is no myth to break in of speakers, I've tested them both ways, and break in is real. I've also done the Celestion "How to Break In a Speaker" method, and it doesn't work well, period. It needs way more than their minimal time frame of playing to break it in 95% of the way.

Speakers can and do last 30-40 years, sometimes longer. If you think you can get a speaker broken in within a few hours with a fat tone and clean chords, then your idea of break in is a lot less than what most guitar players feel "broken in" actually is.

I just did a percentage check of my sales over the last 2-3 months, and over 97% of my sales had break in added to their orders. That's kind of definitive, IMO.
 

Tone Meister

Member
Messages
3,268
You'll need a good 18-24 hours on a variac (set properly to the right voltage) for M to H magnet speakers, and that will get it to 90-95%, typically. If you want to break in a speaker by playing, figure 20-30w of power and 50-60 hours. There is no myth to break in of speakers, I've tested them both ways, and break in is real. I've also done the Celestion "How to Break In a Speaker" method, and it doesn't work well, period. It needs way more than their minimal time frame of playing to break it in 95% of the way.

Speakers can and do last 30-40 years, sometimes longer. If you think you can get a speaker broken in within a few hours with a fat tone and clean chords, then your idea of break in is a lot less than what most guitar players feel "broken in" actually is.

I just did a percentage check of my sales over the last 2-3 months, and over 97% of my sales had break in added to their orders. That's kind of definitive, IMO.
This mirrors my experienceS, most especially with the more robust speakers such as the EVM12L and this one. Todd lives close enough that he's gonna send me the speaker for break-in on the variac. I will be using Jim's method, which he communicated to me directly in an email.
 

swiveltung

Member
Messages
14,492
I've heard speakers that changed a lot after a long break in. Also speakers that I like better right out of the box.... after break in got a little more loose than I wanted. Celestion Greenbacks in a DR was this way for me. Loved it at first, after well broken in, it would just get too nasty driven hard on some songs. That's a 25 watt speaker in a 22 watt amp though.
Some Webers may take a long break in and not be great until they are broken in. It maybe be the tight tolerances they use. Not sure.
 
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toddincharlotte

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,813
stop wasting time and just play the dang thing :)
I've got six hours on the speaker and it's still fizzy as hell. I've pulled it and put my Bad Cat Celestion in for the time being. If you heard it you might understand. Basically unplayable due to the high end fizz, it's like having an undesirable drive character in the signal and not being able to get rid of it.
 

swiveltung

Member
Messages
14,492
I've had pre broken in speakers a few times, frankly, they don't sound broken in to me and still need a while to break in.
 

gigs

Member
Messages
10,946
Have plenty of Weber speakers. 10"s, 12"s, and a 15". Each one I had to break in. When I would leave for work, I would play music through the speakers for 8-9 hours a day, for at least a week. Each night I would play guitar thru them, sometimes loud. After a few weeks, they were sounding just as expected. Some of them did start out harsh and brittle sounding, others started out not so bad. If I recall correctly, the 15" took the longest to break in, while the 10's didn't take as long. I also found that band practice really helped break them in... 4 hours of hard driving each time.

I remember when the 15" finally hit the sweet spot, it was amazing and still is. It happened overnight it seemed, after lots of break in. I looked at it to check if it was the same speaker.
 




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