Speaker mixing question

[Guitarcrazy]

Hi all.

I have a 1960ax Marshall cabinet that I use with both my Marshall Super & 18 watt clone. It has 4 Greenback reissues. Basically I like the overall sound, except for the occasional icepick spike that I'm getting with these speakers. I've been doing a lot of thinking/research, and think that I want to mix 2 other speakers with the GB reissues (maybe giving me more bass, smoothing out the treble a little). Does anyone have any experience with either mixing Eminence Red Fangs, Private Jacks/Governors/Wizards, Celestion G12h30's, or Weber 1230 or 1230-55's? I'm somewhat interested in the Red Fangs, since I'm thinking that the slight compression that I'd get would help with that. My musical tastes really run toward blues, classic rock. More specifically I love that old Jimmy Page 72/73 live sound with the slight overdrive ... smooth & creamy . I know the reissues are bashed a lot, but if I could mix a pair of speakers to smooth out the sound ... I'd be relatively happy.

Another thing, I've heard a lot about Eminence speakers & cone cry. I'm hoping that I'll never drive them that hard that I'll hear that ... but you never know. I have heard cone cry in a Vintage 30 one time - only speaker I've ever heard that from (in my limited experience).

Open to other suggestions, such as fabric replacement ... etc.

DonM

 

[tonedaddy]

Here's a few previous threads that may help:

https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/83958
https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/63242
https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/63631


And welcome to the Gear Page!

 

[Guitarcrazy]

Thanks for the links.

I had already read through about half of that Eminence thread started by Roccaforte ... great stuff. From all the good & bad, I just wanted some more information, from someone's who had some experience.

I'm leaning toward getting 2 Weber Silver Bells.

DonM

 

[Reeek]

The best combo I have ever experienced is a Weber ceramic Blue Dog coupled with a Weber ceramic Silver Bell. A blend made in heaven IMHO.

 

[el34power]

Originally posted by Guitarcrazy
Thanks for the links.

I had already read through about half of that Eminence thread started by Roccaforte ... great stuff. From all the good & bad, I just wanted some more information, from someone's who had some experience.

I'm leaning toward getting 2 Weber Silver Bells.

DonM

Hey there. I have 2 greenback RI's mixed with 2 red fangs in my JCM800 4x12. Sounds fantastic BUT!
How old is your cab? I found the Greenbacks to be too agressive in the begining also BUT (again) After several hours of playing and plugging the cab in to the stereo system and palying the radio threw it during a few entire weekends it made all the difference in the world. I found myself cranking the highs back up a bit they were so smooth. I think the main reason people dislike the reissues is because they expect them to sound like 20 year old cones. IMHO I bet $100.00 on the fact that this is one of the main things celestion is doing to the heritage series. All they are doing is breaking them in.
In other words. If i would have known then what i know now. I would have gotten 4 greenbacks right off the bat!
Again IMO if you like that Page hearbreaker/Blackmore woman from tokyo "honk" I would stick with a nicely broken-in quad'o Greenbacks.

My two cents...Canadian...

 

[Scumback Speakers]

el34power, you'd lose your bet on the Heritage speaker "break-in" thought. Marshall is getting the Celestion 20w Heritage "broken in/aged" by Celestion to use in their "HandWired" amp combos (18watt).

They're not doing any break in of the Heritages at all from what I was told. They're building them to (new/NOS) 1967 speaker specs.

 

[el34power]

Well, comming from you... I'll buy that
What i really meant was. Before you ditch the RI's in a new 1960ax cab and spent loads of money....give'em a chance to break-in...

 

[Strung Up]

Originally posted by Reeek
The best combo I have ever experienced is a Weber ceramic Blue Dog coupled with a Weber ceramic Silver Bell. A blend made in heaven IMHO.

+1

Best sounding cab I ever had was a Bog oversize straight 4 x 12 w/ 2 Blue Dogs and 2 Silver Bells. Perfect for everything from Rock through Blues, to (surprisingly) Jazz. Yes, jazz. Only thing it couldn't do was spare my L4 - L6 vertebrae, so it had to go.

 

[Scumback Speakers]

The fastest way is to run alot of bass through those RI's. Fred @ /13 did that to his cab while he was still touring, and says he always gets compliments on the tone of that cab. He did that for a few years though, to get it there...

 

[Guitarcrazy]

Thanks for all the replies. Gives me a lot to think about. I'm by nature a analytical type person, and am in no rush to 'waste' money. I did a quick test this afternoon (day off yahoo), in which I tested each one individually (through a attenuator of course). 1 out of the 4 I really liked. 2 were probably due to not being broken in enough. 1 was giving me some obnoxious frequency spikes. I did do a minor break in, using a filament transformer 6.3v (low, but I didn't want to damage them) at about 12 hrs each. This was about 3 months ago. Sounds like I should try some other means for breaking them in....

I've had the cab. for about 2-1/2 years, just haven't really played it as much as I'd like. Recently upgrading my Marshall Super ('88 reissue) with a Metro ptp board with Sozo's (the old pcb had 'lego caps on it) .... I'm on that path now toward tonal bliss. Funny how many amps/guitars/effects I've gone through, never thinking once about speaker replacement.

Has anyone tried mixing Greenback's with Weber Silver Bell alnico's?

DonM

Ps - I did listen to the Scumbag clips recently. Unfortunately, it really didn't give me a good enough impression of any of the speakers to make me take the plunge ... (great effort though).

 

[riffmeister]

how 'bout a Cannibis Rex? 'upposed to have a smooth high end......

 

[Guitarcrazy]

Originally posted by riffmeister
how 'bout a Cannibis Rex? 'upposed to have a smooth high end......

Dave @ Avatar steered me away from that one. I'd like to hear any opinions though, from real users. Could be that it takes a lot to break it in ...

DonM

 

[Ohmie]

What about using the Weber "Beam Blockers" on your speakers? They're supposed to diffuse the highs better, making them less ice-picky.

 

[dbeeman]

The fastest way is to run alot of bass through those RI's.

I have my son play bass through new speakers andthat helps -just don't overdo it.

I also use warble tones in various freqs over 24 hours - that is how I broke in my scumbacks


and before anybody else says to play guitars through them at hi volumes for 100 hours

....many of us wish we could, don't have that much time to play

 

[Guitarcrazy]

Originally posted by dbeeman
I have my son play bass through new speakers andthat helps -just don't overdo it.

I also use warble tones in various freqs over 24 hours - that is how I broke in my scumbacks


and before anybody else says to play guitars through them at hi volumes for 100 hours

....many of us wish we could, don't have that much time to play

I have a filament transformer that I'll use to do the dirty work (60 hz hum should beat them into submission).

What Scumbag speakers did you order, and how do you like them? I listened to all of those clips he did a few weeks back, and just can't make any determination from them. At this point, though, I'm really starting to lean toward just getting a pair of Silver Bells. Question is, do I want alnico (more expensive), or ceramic? The alnico one's would give me a little more compression, and probably a sweeter breakup (which is what I'm looking for anyway).

DonM

 

[dbeeman]

What Scumbag speakers did you order, and how do you like them?

I got the Sa12 75 hz and 55 hz

these speakers both have a good bite to them, with 75hz being more in your face and the 55 having more thump.

Both SAs are on the bright side, but not harsh. Top end similar to a Cele Blue (but withiout the alniconess)

They are cousins to the Weber 1230 speakers