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Sprague Atoms @ Mouser

Discussion in 'Amps/Cabs Tech Corner: Amplifier, Cab & Speakers' started by RussB, May 20, 2011.

  1. RussB

    RussB low rent hobbyist Silver Supporting Member

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    Been a couple years since I did a cap job. I just got a minty Fender Quad Reverb from late 1971 here for a cap job/tune up. I like to buy my electrolytics from Mouser.com because they are always fresh...

    It seems the "new" Sprague Atoms they stock these days days are the ROHS compliant ones, and their cost was about double what the "regular" Atoms are.

    Caps for said QR came up to $106 from Mouser. Instead I ordered F&T filter caps with Atom bypass & bias caps from AES, $48. The amp's owner will be pleased with the savings :)

    So what gives with these ROHS compliant caps? Anyone using them?
     
  2. Trout

    Trout Member

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    They still have the 20uf/500V non-compliant and it looks like the price went up again as well.(likely not a value you needed)
    http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Vishay/TVA1906/?qs=F20Wy1M9%252b0IwgrzvEw4AWQ%3d%3d

    When I looked briefly I did not see any atom series that were compliant.
     
  3. LowellH

    LowellH Member

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    Anyone seen or used these 450V Sprague caps? Ordered about a dozen generic 22µ caps a few months ago from a large electronics retailer, just to bring the total up enough to get free shipping. Wasn't sure what I'd get, but was very surprised to see these tiny "Sprague" caps. Haven't tried them yet . . .

    [​IMG]
     
  4. mxvin

    mxvin Member

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    I hear the Big Blue Atoms are nothing more than a smaller cap in a big blue paper cyclinder. I think you have just proved that. Cant imaging the 500 V vs the 450 V would be such a size diff. Also I used some Atoms last month and on two caps the leads just fell off. I got them at Antique Electronics Supply. Great place and great customer service. They took them back no questions answered. I have since use a coupled dozen of the FT caps. They are smaller, less expensive and seemed to be better made.
     
  5. brad347

    brad347 Member

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    It's mostly F&T for my own stuff. They perform fine, look good, are small, and cheaper.
     
  6. RussB

    RussB low rent hobbyist Silver Supporting Member

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    Yeah, the 20/500 non rohs were in stock, but the 100/350's (TVA1620) are not.

    All the rohs compliant Atoms have an E3 suffix
     
  7. 1guitarslinger

    1guitarslinger Member

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  8. Trout

    Trout Member

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    No Kidding!!

    My guess is they(mouser) are looking at the target market, Most of the other distributors/parts places are not showing any big jumps (yet).

    Seems to me that the black ones here are not actually Sprague "Atoms" I seem to remember them suggesting the use of the newer series on their site,
    Think that's them?

    [​IMG]
     
  9. RussB

    RussB low rent hobbyist Silver Supporting Member

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    Yeah...

    Atoms for your basic SF Fender (2@100/350, 3@20/500, 7@25/25 and 2@100/100) cost over a $100 from Mouser.

    I went with F&T's with Atom 25/25's and Xicon 100/100's from AES for $48.80
     
  10. 1guitarslinger

    1guitarslinger Member

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    That probably is the newer series they were trying to get people to use.

    The high price at Mouser may not be that they raised theirs when others didn't. I have seen other parts that Mouser has very high prices on compared to other parts houses. Not sure what the deal is with them.
     
  11. TweeDLX

    TweeDLX Member

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    I really like the F&T's and Illinois caps for their smaller size (which is really nice when you're inside a tweed style chassis!). I've used them in about 4-5 builds over the last few years with absolutely no issues (except the ones I create myself) :).
     
  12. LowellH

    LowellH Member

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    Those tiny Spragues were only $2.13 after discount from MCM. They did not list the Mfr and I was expecting to get some generic Chinese caps.
     
  13. CaptainJake

    CaptainJake Member

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    The old Atoms are antiquated parts... there's no reason for new electrolytic caps to be as large as the Atoms
     
  14. Structo

    Structo Member

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    Atoms seemed to go up every year the last few years.

    There has been a lot of stuff happening with electrolytic caps in the last five years.
    Reports of counterfeits and having smaller radial caps inside the cans of axial caps.

    New electrolytics are tiny in comparison to older E caps.

    There is no reason those Sprague Atom caps should be that large anymore and the proof is those black 450v caps.
    But you have to be careful as the counterfeit caps are profitable to Chinese manufacturers.

    Here is a Sprague Atom dissected.

    [​IMG]

    Here is a Elon 40uf 500v cap cut apart.
    Notice the cap inside is a 330uf 200v radial cap!

    [​IMG]

    Not only is that a rip off but is really dangerous since you would assume it can safely handle near 500v but is only rated at 200v.

    Somebody theorized that there are very few true axial caps being made since most production is pcb and radial leaded caps are only used there.

    You can usually tell the bad electrolytic caps because they will have a crimp on both ends with the black rubber stoppers.
    Real E caps only have one crimped end with the other end bare aluminum with the lead spot welded to it.

    Who knows but, BUYER BEWARE!
     
  15. 1guitarslinger

    1guitarslinger Member

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    Actually there's no reason for the Atoms to be as large as they are. If you cut open the current 20uF 500V you'll find the "innards" are much smaller than the can. Probably the same as inside those smaller ones.

    Sprague keeps raising the prices of the Atoms to try to ween people off of them and apparently using less expensive innards too, but folks keep using them, including Fender recently and many "boutique" builders. Sprague must be laughing all the way to the bank.
     
  16. 1guitarslinger

    1guitarslinger Member

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    Do you know of anyone who has actually gotten a hold of some counterfeit caps? That's freaky stuff.

    You wouldn't think it would be worth it to counterfeit axial lead caps, same way everyone thought that nobody would counterfeit $1 bills (other than the Federal Reserve). But they do counterfeit $1 bills. I've seen one.
     
  17. Trout

    Trout Member

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    There are lots of posts on forums about fake and counterfeit caps. The thing is, unless you have one in your hand, it is hard to weed out the possible hoax posts Vs Fact.
    Many PC companies got his by sub-standard caps some years back as well. Most of that was sub-contracted bad caps using a bad electrolytic formula or so the story goes.

    Crazy times we live in I guess.

    Ebay does have one of their counterfeit warning pages devoted to fake ruby caps though.
    http://reviews.ebay.com/Fake-RubyCon-Electrolytic-Capacitors-on-Ebay_W0QQugidZ10000000009070950

    [​IMG]
    Others are out there as well.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks Member

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    i tried to use some atoms but the sizes were just obnoxious. they take up almost twice as much real estate.

    the real issue is that for the most part axial leaded electros are obsolete in high voltages.
     
  19. 1guitarslinger

    1guitarslinger Member

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    Yeah man. What have things come to?

    Check this out from a recent box of D'Addario strings -



    Thank you and congratulations for purchasing D'Addario Strings. In today's competitive global market it is not uncommon for market-leading products to be copied and counterfeited. While copying one's work is the highest form of flattery, counterfeiting and trading off someone else's intellectual property is unethical and illegal.

    Recently we have instituted the 'Play Real, Play D'Addario' marketing and tracking program. Each legitimate set of D'Addario strings has a unique code or serial number printed on the inner plastic bag (see 10-digit code on reverse side). If you suspect that these strings are not legitimate D'Addario, Made-in-America strings, please log onto www.daddario.com/playreal and enter this code. It will indicate whether this is an authentic D'Addario product.

    If you find this code is not authentic and you fill out the subsequent D'Addario Counterfeit report form, identifying the merchant that sold you the counterfeit product, you will receive a gift of D'Addario product with our compliments.

     
  20. Slunderfungus

    Slunderfungus Member

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    Yeah, I used the big blue atoms in my first build and had to find a way to tuck them under the board in the tiny chassis I am using. I am in the process of re-doing alot of that build and the biggest re-do is pulling out the blue caps and replacing them either with a JJ 40/20/20/20 or some TAD 16uf 475v I bought a while back that are lessthan half the size of the "atoms".

    [​IMG]

    From now on I will find smaller caps or use canister style multi caps that mount on top of the chassis.
     

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