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Strange rings after wet sanding - What is it? (pics)

troyw

Member
Messages
91
Hey all,

I just started on wet sanding a strat build that has tru-oil as the finish. I'm coming up with this weird patterned rings and since this is my first build, I wanted to check and see if this is normal or if I'm in some sort of trouble here. It started right away after sanding wet with 600. I thought maybe it could change after moving up to a higher grade paper but I did the next step and it didn't really change. it's a nice flat surface but I'm a little concerned as to what this is.

This had about 20-30 coats of oil with light sanding and steel wooling between coats here and there.

Can anyone shed some light on this for me?


 

touji

Member
Messages
264
^ I do too XD

As long as the wood isn't being hurt, I think it would make the guitar look very unique :D
 

uberpict

Member
Messages
504
Are you using an orbital sander without a felt pad? My guess is the sanding is bringing out high and low spots in the finish. Either that or it's something to do with the fact that oil and water don't mix. Maybe try a little soap in the water to see if it smooths out. It does look really cool, BTW!
 

troyw

Member
Messages
91
Yeah, it does look interesting only it's not quite what I'm going for ...the front is a hand rubbed burst. I just did a shot of the back since it was easier to see on the black.

I guess I should add that I did use soap in the water when I sanded. Uberpict...I'm kind of with you on the highs and lows thing. I'm just wonder if I should go back to 600 and dig a little deeper or keep going up in grades and hope it will rub out.

Anyone else? I'm kind hangin' here trying to figure out where to go form here.

Thanks, Troy
 

David Collins

Member
Messages
2,246
You're hitting the high spots and sanding them matte, leaving the low spots that aren't being sanded still shiny. With lacquer you would sand with a stiff backing until every little speck of gloss is gone, at which point you know it's flat. Then it goes to buffing.

I've never used true oil, and have no idea how it builds, buffs, sands, etc, so I don't know how much of a build you have to work with. When I finish with lacquer I go for dead flat mirror finish. Without knowing your thickness and what end result you're going for though, don't blame me if you go through.
 

uberpict

Member
Messages
504
Drop back to between 200-300 and remove the high spots then go back up to around 400 and finish with 600. 600 is really fine, almost emory cloth, so you shouldn't need much after that.
 

doublee

Member
Messages
4,434
Was that new wood or stripped wood? I would guess there is something underneath thats doing that?
 

troyw

Member
Messages
91
Thanks guys - Everything I've read about tru-oil said you can treat it pretty mcuh the same as lacquer.

Doublee...it was new wood. Here is the recipe...

Aniline Dye
Oil based filler.
Couple coats of bullseye sealcoat.
30 or so coats of tru-oil
 

scott

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
4,897
It looks like its not sanded flat. you need to sand it really flat(no shiny spots) then add a few more coats then try the wet sanding buff stage.
 
Messages
354
This is just a thought, as I know nothing about refinishing whatsoever. But is it possible that the water is reacting with the Tru Oil? Water and Oil don't like each other much....
 

fretless

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
5,569
Why did you choose to wet sand? With tru oil it's best to simply give a light buff with 0000 steel wool between coats and then finish with a buff using "rough" material (like a worn piece of denim). Should end up with a glassy finish. Based on my experience working with tru oil and laquer are two totally different things.

How about a few more coats of oil and a final buff without the wetsand? Worth a shot, and I think it might get you where you want to be.

If you check out the Reranch forum there's a TON of tru oil finishing posts over there for research. I hope all goes well on your project!!
 

Maxer

Member
Messages
438
Whatever the issue, I kinda like it too... an unusual texture but still very pleasantly organic... like an alien wood species.

Maybe next time you could work with it deliberately, develop a finish like that.
 

troyw

Member
Messages
91
This was how most of the guys at reranch suggest I finish with the TO...thay said it was pretty much the same drill as lacquer. Everything else I read seemed to say the same thing.
 

rick13

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
770
It almost looks like something in the wood is outgassing and causing the tru-oil to delaminate. I tru-oiled my neck and buffed with a very fine abrasive pad between coats. Worked great!. Perhaps you didn't scuff it enough between coats and let it dry?
Rick
 

12guitdown

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
2,480
Troy, I had the same thing happen to me last year when refinishing my tele w/TO. It was either the highs and lows or actually I thought it was all the layers of different coats showing. (I also wet sanded using soap too.) So I figured to test a small area with the sanding block to see if it evened out or went through. Yup, it ultimately went through and I could see little bits of wood grain bleeding through the stain.:jo I touched it up, put another ten coats on, started to sand and it happened again.:confused: I was totally puzzled by this, even to this day. I mean I followed everyone's recommendations at reranch etc. and still couldn't get it right. I tried buffing it, using different sanding methods, nothing would get rid of it. It was something in the T.O. So I sanded everything back, re-stained, then finished with about 5-6 super thin coats of minwax wipe on poly. That was a lot easier, less time consuming and the result was good. The only thing I could think of is that the T.O. was either rancid, or didn't get along with the oil based stain beneath it. I'd still like to know what caused it. Maybe post a photo of it over at reranch. One of those guys will know for sure. And I'm not sure it can be remedied.
 

troyw

Member
Messages
91
Hey 12...did you try the micromesh papers instead of wetsending...I got it back to what it looked like between coats yesterday...just used a little 0000 on it and it all came back to matte. I was thinking of trying to add a few coats the then use the mirco papers on it instead of the wet sanding
 




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