TC Flashback kills my Big Muff's tone.

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by Shambles, Feb 18, 2012.

  1. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    When I use my Flashback delay with my NYC Big Muff, the Muff loses its grit and sounds muddy. It sounds fine when bypassed, but muddy with the effect on. Is there anyway to fix this or is it just the effect itself coloring the Muff? Could it have something to do with the buffers in the Boss pedals?

    If it helps, my set up is a Crybaby 535q > MXR Dynacomp > Boss Os-2 > Muff > Flashback > Boss Rc-2 looper > amp
     
  2. ZeroChan

    ZeroChan Member

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    Maybe an impedance issue? IIRC my long gone DL-4 did that for my muffs too. But all it did is smooth out the grittiness of the in a good way.
     
  3. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    This isn't in a good way. Even when the Sustain is all the way up or if it is boosted with the OS-2, the tone goes away when the delay is on.
     
  4. whoismarykelly

    whoismarykelly Oh look! This is a thing I can change!

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    Well if you use delay with fuzz its going to get a little bit muddy since you've got repeats going on top of the dry signal.
     
  5. HayekFan

    HayekFan Member

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    Does it sound muddy with the TC on and the Muff off? IOW, is it affecting the Muff specifically or is it affecting any incoming signal?

    Do you have the Muff's output set high enough that it's overdriving the TC's input?

    If you're using a battery in the TC, is it good?

    The TC has a high enough input impedence that there should be no interaction with a Muff.
     
  6. jnepo1

    jnepo1 Silver Supporting Member

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    Can you post your chain? Also, the Flashback has a buffer switch w/in the unit, have you made adjustments w/in the unit itself? Try changing the internal switches.
     
  7. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    I have the internal switch set to true bypass. The other switch is a "kill-dry" switch, and I have that off. I listened to the muff when the buffer setting was on and It sucked my tone like when the pedal is on.

    Chain: Crybaby 535q > MXR Dynacomp > Boss Os-2 > Big Muff > Flashback > Boss Rc-2 looper > amp
     
  8. HayekFan

    HayekFan Member

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    Yeah, something's wrong with the input buffer of the TC. It shouldn't do that.
     
  9. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    Can you explain what the input buffer does?
     
  10. duende

    duende Member

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    Put the fx mix on the flashback to full dry. Kick in the muff. Does it still sound horrible?

    If it does, then what you are hearing is simply the cheap headroom of the flashback. Mixing in the wet fx will only make it worse.

    Not so noticeble at bedroom levels, but definitely a form of fuzz castration on stage or through a real amp.

    Sold mine because it just couldn't hang with the other fx in my rig. Liked the sound, but not the compromise in headroom and clarity.
     
  11. lux_interior

    lux_interior Member

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    Out of all the delays I've heard, tried and owned, the Flashback would be one of those that I would least expect to have a problem with headroom and clarity. As for changing the character of fuzzes, I haven't noticed that either.
     
  12. Jove

    Jove Member

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    This is the same journey the other guitarist in my group went through. The Flashback was impossible to use in his very basic setup (maybe 4 pedals) without it messing up the tone. I mentioned it in a thread awhile ago for some suggestions and besides people getting defensive there were very few solid recommendations. And none that worked, so he returned it.

    I think it's a cool sounding pedal but using it in a real world setting, it does all the things that I am skeptical of when it comes to digital all-in-one style boxes.

    J
     
  13. sameoldblues

    sameoldblues Supporting Member

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    Sounds weird to me. One of the many things I love about the Flashback is how well it preserves my dry signal when engaged...but everybody's rig is different. I run into an amp set at maximum clean, and have my drives set for a slight boost when engaged (no more than a few dbs). My strat has low output to begin with, and my "muff" is a Toptone DG-2, which has more mids than the standard muff circuit.

    I used a vintage Ram's Head for a little while, and did notice that you've gotta run a traditional muff quite high on the volume knob to compensate for the mid scoop. If you're running a hot guitar signal into a cranked-up muff, maybe a boost or two later in the chain, and an amp that's already breaking up, I could maybe see the FB not getting along with your rig...but, then again, it may be difficult to find a delay pedal that would.
     
  14. scolfax

    scolfax Member

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    Do the TC pedals keep your through-signal analog?
     
  15. dougb415

    dougb415 Member

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    Does your amp have an FX loop? If so, try putting the FB there.
     
  16. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    I took out the Boss RC-2 and now the Flashback is the last pedal in the chain. This seemed to make it a little better. This is why I wonder if it is a buffer issue in the Boss Pedals. I also turned the OS-2 all the way to distortion (it does overdrive and distortion) and turned the drive all the way up to see how the TC affected it and the OS-2 is not affected when the TC is on. Could it have something to do with the Muff'c circuit?
     
  17. Shambles

    Shambles Member

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    It does not.
     
  18. HayekFan

    HayekFan Member

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    I just glanced at some schematics and it looks the Big Muff has a relatively high output impedence. That means the pedal that follows it will need to have a well buffered input for there not to be a loss of high frequencies and possibly an overall volume drop. Your Boss pedals have modern buffered outputs with low output impedences which means they're not going to be real picky about what follows them. I have a feeling that your Flashback pedal has got issues with its input circuitry. It seems to be presenting a lower than normal input impedence. Your Boss pedals don't care but it's showing up with the Muff.

    That's what it sounds like to me anyway.

    For the record I have a TC Flashback and I have not had any problems with overdriving its input unless I massively crank the output level of the pedal in front of it. So I don't think that's what it is. Plus an overdriven input sounds like raspy distortion, not muffledness.

    I've never put a Muff in front of my Flashback but a properly working Flashback should have no frequency loss issues even with the Muff's relatively high output impedence. I'm pretty sure there's something wrong with your Flashback.

    For info on what buffers do I'd do a google search, and I'd include the names of smart pedal gurus as keywords -- like Jack Orman or RG Keen, who have probably written on the subject. Hopefully that will lead you to some good info and steer you clear of the blind-leading-the-blind confusion that's out there.
     
  19. solitaire

    solitaire Senior Member

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    Yes, the toneprint ones do.
     
  20. scolfax

    scolfax Member

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    That's great news, thanks!
     

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