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The Answer: Blackface/Marshall in one amp*

Stu Blue

Member
Messages
3,167
I did the blackface and Superlead with an A/B at each show for awhile. I found that in the mix, the transition between the two was too drastic to sound right. For my purposes, going from plexi clean to Plexi/800 distortion makes more sense. Recording is a whole other animal though.
That was my experience as well. Plexi cleans work better than Fender ones for rock stuff anyway.... you'd be surprised how often the "Fender clean sound" on a recording is actually a Marshall.
 

CharlyG

Play It Forward
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
7,770
The Egnater Renegade does more than a decent job of doing both, but it doesn't have the price tag for TGP cred.
 

Crash-VR

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
5,163
Threads like this just prove that it's a wonderful time to be into guitar! So many amazing amps and guitars being made by some really great people. I love my RedPlate, but I love many other brands too. I can only afford one high end amp. RedPlate ticks all the boxes. I bought used and was able to sell my OD pedals and attenuator. Turned into a really good deal at that point. The only issue so far, is that it's not nearly as fun around here anymore. I've actually been too deeply focused on my playing! Imagine that...
 

Nelson89

Member
Messages
3,609
Rivera M60. Picked one up second hand. The clean is probably the closest I've gotten to a blackface clean without being a fender amp and the gain is more marshally than my marshall jcm2000 DSL 100 across more of its range. In fairness though the rivera is voiced like a hot rod plexi and the DSL sounds pretty similar on crunch mode on the clean channel when you boost it. In any case, the rivera was an absolute steal second hand and just oozes tone but is heavy enough to prevent it from being my main gigging amp (that and I'm more into class A British tone across the board). The Rivera is also a very ugly amp, luckily mine had the carpet ripped off and the wood stained.
 
Messages
278
Mesa Boogie Electradyne, clean channel is all staright up fender territory, blue channel can easily nail those un modded marshall tone especially in its 45 watts settings with el34 tubes, the red channel is a perfect blend of mark1 and jcm 800 dirt.
 

woof*

Member
Messages
8,760
All these amps are really their own thing...or a compromise and there is nothing wrong with that.
I've been playing for years with both amps in tandem...really rich and best of both worlds.
 

CharlyG

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Silver Supporting Member
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7,770
How are two different amp designs in one chassis a compromise?
 

bbaug14

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,491
How are two different amp designs in one chassis a compromise?
Not sure if this is serious or not but when you put two circuits together in one amp that share the same power section, typically there is a compromise. Tube type, voltages, OT specs, etc. Its just the nature of the beast. That being said, I've played a few I liked better than their standalone counterparts. So, play and play and play and find what works for you.
 

mikebat

Member
Messages
11,487
So....

Redplate Magica
Bogner Goldfinger
Friedman Dirty Shirley (single channel, my opinion, does not fit THIS profile)
65 Amps Whiskey
3rd Power - Dream Weaver
Egantor/Randall ETS
Rivera M60
Mesa - Electrodyne

These are what TGP has come up with so far. A pretty decent array.

I think that this is the true holy grail of gigging amps, the footswitchable Fender clean/Marshall dirty amp. Something that has the headroom to play big clean chords with a rock drummer, and have enough drive and compression that no dirt pedals are needed. If you can have a bright clean sound and a dirty sound that is not all spitty and frayed....I think you have a winner.

I think we can add:

Friedman - SS, or HBE
Suhr- PT100 V2
Mesa - RA100
PWE- EH3
 

CharlyG

Play It Forward
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
7,770
Not sure if this is serious or not but when you put two circuits together in one amp that share the same power section, typically there is a compromise. Tube type, voltages, OT specs, etc. Its just the nature of the beast. That being said, I've played a few I liked better than their standalone counterparts. So, play and play and play and find what works for you.
Well, my Renegade has two power sections,EL-34 and 6L6, or whatever else your heart desires. They do share the same power supply, but the two "amps" are not on at the same time.
 

LPMojoGL

Music Room Superstar
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
9,252
So....

Redplate Magica
Bogner Goldfinger
Friedman Dirty Shirley (single channel, my opinion, does not fit THIS profile)
65 Amps Whiskey
3rd Power - Dream Weaver
Egantor/Randall ETS
Rivera M60
Mesa - Electrodyne

These are what TGP has come up with so far. A pretty decent array.

I think that this is the true holy grail of gigging amps, the footswitchable Fender clean/Marshall dirty amp. Something that has the headroom to play big clean chords with a rock drummer, and have enough drive and compression that no dirt pedals are needed. If you can have a bright clean sound and a dirty sound that is not all spitty and frayed....I think you have a winner.

I think we can add:

Friedman - SS, or HBE
Suhr- PT100 V2
Mesa - RA100
PWE- EH3

This belongs on that list, if that is what we're doing here...

Fargen Dual British Classic - 2014
Dual Channel (BF Deluxe + Plexi/800)

Fargen delivers the best of Blackface Fender, Marshall Plexi & Marshall JCM800 in one portable lightweight 25 watt hand wired tube amp.
Full channel switching design and full tube buffered FX loop.
Hand crafted in the USA by Benjamin Fargen


 

sleewell

Senior Member
Messages
10,590
sound is more than just a preamp. having two different preamp sounds going in to the same power amp and same speakers is not going to sound the same as two separate amps and speakers.
 

CharlyG

Play It Forward
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
7,770
The Renegade is two POWER amps. It has both EL34 and 6L6 channels with a footswitch for channel, fx loop, reverb, and boost, all but channel with switches for either or both.The preamp is the same but with it's own controls on each channel.
 

MHG

Member
Messages
6,162
D-style amps with the BluesMaster voicing have Blackface cleans with Marshall style overdrive.
 

bbaug14

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,491
The Renegade is two POWER amps. It has both EL34 and 6L6 channels with a footswitch for channel, fx loop, reverb, and boost, all but channel with switches for either or both.The preamp is the same but with it's own controls on each channel.
No, it isn't. It has the ability to run two sets of tubes with the same power section at the same time via relays. PI, OT, PT are all common. Hence, the compromise. Believe me, I have one and have completely changed it, so I am very familiar with the design.
 

CharlyG

Play It Forward
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
7,770
No, it isn't. It has the ability to run two sets of tubes with the same power section at the same time via relays. PI, OT, PT are all common. Hence, the compromise. Believe me, I have one and have completely changed it, so I am very familiar with the design.
You MUST mean the power supply. If you crank each mix knob to the appropriate tube, it is running by itself. Power section and power supply are not synonymous in my world. Yes the transformers are common, but common to the design of Fender/Marshall in one box. Also, as long as the transformer can handle the appropriate output, how different are they , really?
 






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