Theoretical Question: Can I split my signal before a fuzz without tone loss?

the tourist

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3,405
Just like the title says. Is it possible? If I put a buffered splitter before a fuzz, doesn't that mess up the fuzz sound? And if I use a non-buffered splitter before the fuzz, isn't my signal kinda ruined? Is there a way to get around it? If I place a buffer after the fuzz in the A chain and a buffer after the splitter in the B chain, would I retain my full tone even if I ran it as a Y?
 

stinkfoot

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6,138
If you want to split and still retain the tone, you need a buffer before the split. The split will load down the pickups, so the buffer is needed to protect them from that loading. Adding buffers after the pedals will not bring back what was lost earlier due to the loading.

I'd suggest looking for a fuzz that doesn't mind being driven by a low impedance signal. It's mostly the fuzz face circuit (and its derivatives/cousins) that is affected this way, since they rely on loading down the pickups quite heavily. Adding a buffer in front of one of those negates that loading, which in turn changes the sound. But there are fuzzes around that can be fed from a buffer - not least the Boss FZ series (since they are buffered themselves).
 

the tourist

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3,405
Well rats. I've got some Lumpy's pedals on the way that I'm going to try out (Germanium Class A Overdrive, Albion Mini, SLPre, and Brilliance Boost) and I was hoping to be able to split my signal before them to send a clean signal to a second amp solely for octave-up 100% wet reverb. Not sure how they'll interact with a buffer before them, though. Hm.
 

AXXA

Silver Supporting Member
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7,102
It was pretty weird when I did it with out a buffer (passively). I put a fuzz face on one side and a rangemaster on the other, and somehow the fuzz bled into both sides. It also sounded quite weak. Putting a buffer first sounds terrible with both of those circuits, so I ditched the idea.

That said, there are plenty of circuits that can sound decent with a buffer
 
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I must sound like a broken record because I seem to say this a lot. And I am not a Boss fanboy. But, if the fuzz in question can tolerate a buffer before it, a Boss LS-2 will do what you want quite nicely. And you'll have level controls for each output. It is a pretty handy and versatile pedal.

Willie
 

the tourist

Member
Messages
3,405
It was pretty weird when I did it with out a buffer (passively). I put a fuzz face on one side and a rangemaster on the other, and somehow the fuzz bled into both sides. It also sounded quite weak. Putting a buffer first sounds terrible with both of those circuits, so I ditched the idea.

That said, there are plenty of circuits that can sound decent with a buffer
Thanks for the info! Guess I'll just have to try it myself. Maybe the Lumpy's pedals will be okay with a buffer in front? I'll find out soon!

I must sound like a broken record because I seem to say this a lot. And I am not a Boss fanboy. But, if the fuzz in question can tolerate a buffer before it, a Boss LS-2 will do what you want quite nicely. And you'll have level controls for each output. It is a pretty handy and versatile pedal.

Willie
I actually just recently got an LS-2 to run two delays in parallel to the same amp (one dotted 8ths and one quarter note). Not even on my board yet. I don't think I'd need the level control for the initial split as the reason I want to split before dirt is that I want to send a clean signal to a second amp for the sole purpose of shimmer. I suppose I might just have to deal with dirty shimmer.
 

Dave Fox

Senior Pedalmaker
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731
It was pretty weird when I did it with out a buffer (passively). I put a fuzz face on one side and a rangemaster on the other, and somehow the fuzz bled into both sides. It also sounded quite weak. Putting a buffer first sounds terrible with both of those circuits, so I ditched the idea.
...
Yeah, that's what happens. If you split before the FF, the loading from the input of the FF cuts the level and distorts the signal and you're left with a dull, fuzzy sound on the other side of the split. If you have a Fuzz Face clone that inlcudes an input trimmer, you can dial in some series resistance and that will take away the fuzzyness. You'll still be left with a signal that's dull and lower in level but still usable if you plan on distorting it more. It might actually work out well if driving an analog octave up.
 

J-E-M

Senior Member
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713
Yes, with a buffered splitter, like a Boss LS-2, and only if the pedal can take a buffered signal. I'm using an LS-2 to mix a BAT Pharaoh and Barber Small Fry together - the results are pretty damn good.
 

Nwlp∅

Member
Messages
32
Yeah, that's what happens. If you split before the FF, the loading from the input of the FF cuts the level and distorts the signal and you're left with a dull, fuzzy sound on the other side of the split. If you have a Fuzz Face clone that inlcudes an input trimmer, you can dial in some series resistance and that will take away the fuzzyness. You'll still be left with a signal that's dull and lower in level but still usable if you plan on distorting it more. It might actually work out well if driving an analog octave up.
Just trimmers before octave and germanium fuzzs? Awesome, so just as well, would it simply work right if i put a pot for each send to increase the resistance?
I wanna build a parallel looper to make textures, so i'll want it adjustable to the input of the pedals i split it to. Someone drop me the idea of wiring pickup simulators for the sends. I wonder why seems like impossible from what people usually say (use another fuzz) if it's this simple. Anyway, i'll breadboard both things and hear.
Does anyone knows a good schematic to look to start for one with 3/4 loops? How do i split it in 4?
I also wanna have my input signal to be switchable to be a 4th parallel loop, so i can mix in to the original sound if i want to: a 2pdt footswitch between "clean" and 4th send circuit to the blend stage could be used there right?
I can figure out about the phase correction and the rest of the blend stage looking schematics (ideas are welcome, as i'm gonna begin building with this and a germanium shin ei FY2), i'll tweak it a bit to blend chains with exp pedals, probably i should start drawing a schematic with all this but i mostly worry about the 4 way splitting maintaining (adjusting) touch sensitiveness and keeping the tone plugged in transparent when it's send to the ge fuzzs, analog octavers and such as things.
Any help would be great
 






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