To All of you Rat Users

matt1969

Member
Messages
965
I been using Rats forever. They always sound like I have my wah turned on whenever I roll back the guitar's volume to about 7 or so. Is this what other Rat users experience as well?:dunno

Not a bad thing at all but no matter what single coil guitars I use with my Marshall, it sounds that way.
 
Messages
2,618
I'm not the best person to answer this, as I don't have a RAT. But I do have a Mayer Mongoose, which is supposed to be Roger Mayer's take on a RAT. It has a 'hint' of cocked wah voicing, without any really obvious band-pass filtering.

I believe RATs are hard-clipping circuits, so I think there's something about hard-clipping circuits that can give you a bit of a honk with certain pedal and guitar volume settings. (I also have a Keeley Oxblood, which is supposed to be like a Klon, another hard-clipping circuit, and it has some honk hiding in there somewhere. And some people say Klons sound like RATs...better to just ignore me though.)
 
Messages
1,509
Yeah, they do, but don t put a buffer infront of it, cause unless my memory does not serve me right, they tend to lose this quality in that case (it would be great if you could quickly test this @matt1969 :) )
 

TheoDog

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
19,825
I don't consider the tone close to a cocked wah, but it definitely a hi mid peak. It is the feature that helps the drive tone sit in the mix well instead of disappearing like many other distortions.
I have noticed a few Rats (mostly clones IME) have a narrower sweet spot on the filter knob where it sounds "just right".
 

uyarchie

Member
Messages
181
I tend to look for the sweet spot of that cocked wah sound, but rather we call it a "dog barking" sound in the studio when i was younger.
 

cubistguitar

Member
Messages
5,863
right, thats one of the good features of the box, lots of mids like a peaked freq feel, its really neat with the tone rolled back some
 

voorhiessa

Senior Member
Messages
6,500
I hear the same thing, and it seems like it's much worse with a buffer in front. I've tried a Rat like 4 times, and that's why I can never keep them
 

Kid Casseroli

Member
Messages
802
Not a bad thing at all but no matter what single coil guitars I use with my Marshall, it sounds that way.
Reducing the 47 ohm resistor to 100 ohms in a Rat helps a little by lowering the mid peak slightly. This is called the "Ruetz Mod". It's easy to search for.

The mid peak is critical to maintain cut and clarity in high gain distortion when performing with a band, so if you eliminate it, you no longer have a pedal that excels at high gain as a Rat does.

In an unmodded Rat, that peak will always be present for any position of the guitar's volume knob. As you roll-off the volume on your guitar to reduce distortion, the pronounced mid peak starts to become more noticeable and possibly excessive at that point, producing the wah response you hear.

If I'm using a Rat and want to reduce distortion while avoiding the wah response, I prefer to switch over to an OD pedal such as the Box of Rock that responds well to rolling-off the guitar's volume while maintaining a more even balance in the mids.
 

Lewguitar

Member
Messages
5,664
A lot of guys have only tried a Rat in a music store and hated it.

I think it might be because the tone control works opposite to a normal tone control.

You turn the tone up and it gets less treble.

Turn it down and you get more treble.

Counter intuitive and just plain weird!

I know my buddy Aj hated the Rat until I showed him how to use it.

I like the Rat but I don't use it any more.

When I got an AF1 Klon clone I stopped using the Rat.

And now that I have a Klon KTR I'll probably never return to using the Rat.

Interesting that the same thing happened with Jeff Beck.

He used a Rat for a long time...then he switched to a Klon Centaur and has stayed with it.
 
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matt1969

Member
Messages
965
I have my Rat set like this into a cranked marshall:
Volume: noon, filter between 2 & 3 o'clock & distortion at around 2 o'clock. This is with Strat's / single coils.
Humbucker pickups do not need anything into the amp.
 

Stratobuc

Member
Messages
15,922
I've never been able to bond with a Rat. Then I got a VFE Alpha Dog, which is a variant, with more tweakability. Much, much more. I like it a lot.
 

cbpickin

Tweed Supporting Member
Gold Supporting Member
Messages
7,029
That is true of all unmodded RATs. It is actually one thing I love about RATs, and I am disppointed when a boutique clone doesn't do it.
 

GreenKnight18

Member
Messages
2,206
And now that I have a Klon KTR I'll probably never return to using the Rat.

Interesting that the same thing happened with Jeff Beck.

He used a Rat for a long time...then he switched to a Klon Centaur and has stayed with it.
Clearly you and Jeff Beck are philistines! The correct way to do this is to use the KTR for OD and then slam on the Rat for balls out distortion.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to write this Mr. Beck fellow a strongly-worded email!
 

lavinci

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,655
can anyone recommend a modern version of the Rat?
a pedal builder that has included many of the mods and removed most of the warts of the original design ( tone knob being inverted)
 




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