to tree or not to tree?

Discussion in 'Luthier's Guitar & Bass Technical Discussion' started by One Chord Wonder, Feb 15, 2015.

  1. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    Considering putting a string tree on an Eric Johnson model strat to make bending easier on the E and B strings.

    Who has done this on an EJ strat? Do you feel it was an improvement?
     
  2. swiveltung

    swiveltung Member

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    Hmm... why would a tree make bending easier? It will get rid of ringing overnotes....
     
  3. Cal Webway

    Cal Webway Member

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    prolly cause he had strings popping out of the slot problems...??

    I put a string tree on my 2007 model because of this


    .
     
  4. mc5nrg

    mc5nrg Supporting Member

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    More wraps might do depending on tuner type.
     
  5. Rockinrob86

    Rockinrob86 Supporting Member

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    More wraps is the answer. Or making a new nut with taller slots for those strings, depending on your nut. You just need to increase the break angle over the nut to get them to quit popping out.
     
  6. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    The strings don't leave the nut slot, it's just tough to bend the B and E. Thus I'm considering a string tree.
     
  7. Tone_Terrific

    Tone_Terrific Member

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    Conventional wisdom states that this makes bends more difficult due to increasing drag on the portion of the string beyond the neck.
     
  8. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    Take the E and B strings off the tree of any strat you've got sitting around, retune to pitch, and try bending. I can't adequately explain the physics at work here, but it makes bending noticeably more difficult.
     
  9. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    i have to concur, bending feels better with fenders when the E and B are under a tree.
     
  10. Jonny Hotnuts

    Jonny Hotnuts Member

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    Must be impossible to bend with a lock nut, I mean....if people are really suggesting that the additional length of string aft the nut is a contributing factor to magically changing the tension load or dynamic properties of the string.



    I may not be the sharpest tool in the shed (maybe just a tool!) but I really want someone to attempt to explain how a slight re routing of a sting via the tree (designed to increase the break angle) makes it easier to bend.


    Why dont we just build a guitar with the tuners a couple feet from the nut and have multiple string trees doing zig zags. It would be the easiest guitar to play EVER!!!!!


    ~JH
     
  11. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    good points re the locking nut;

    i dunno if the tree makes the bending easier, just different.
     
  12. SamBooka

    SamBooka Member

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    we get into the string length vs scale length thing in the jazz forums.. usually in regards to the epiphone frequensator bridges. it also pops up from time to time in regards to jags and jazzmasters (extra lenth is behind the bridge instead of the headstock but the result is the same)

    it does make a difference to the feel. when you bend a string with longer lengths you have to bend physically further to achieve the same change in pitch.

    Not a huge difference but if you try a jazzmaster vs a strat you notice it. I have been told you also notice it on righty guitars with lefty necks like hendrix did.
     
  13. Rockinrob86

    Rockinrob86 Supporting Member

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    You may have the bridge springs set too tight. This has a huge affect on the feel of a strat!
     
  14. '59_Standard

    '59_Standard Member

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    For anyone interested in the comparison between a Standard Strat and a Johnson - which has a 1mm thinner headstock and staggered tuners due to his request not to have a tree and supposedly helps with the trem staying in tune.

    Regular:
    [​IMG]

    Johnson:

    [​IMG]
     
  15. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    Yes! And for this reason--easier string bending--I'm considering putting a string tree on my EJ strat.

    I'd like to get some feedback on whether or not I should do a minor, but irreversible, modification on my guitar.

    :wave
     
  16. Tone_Terrific

    Tone_Terrific Member

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    So I popped the e and b out from under the tree to check the feel.
    I don't think I would ever notice..I'm not that sensitive, I guess:cry:
    OP you might try using a little clamp or padding a capo to hold the string as a test tree.
    I don't think there's much magic in this.
     
  17. MRW55

    MRW55 Member

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    I finally broke down two months ago and put one on my EJ, a very early run one I bought used. I'm glad I did it. The high E rings clearer to my ears, and I think bending on the high strings might indeed be a touch easier. But I did it to avoid many downward wraps on the high E and B, and to get the E speak loud and proud. It worked for me.
     
  18. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    Strats don't play quite the same without a string tree.

    With regard to the physics of string bending with/without a tree; less energy is required to push the string across the fret when the length of string between the nut and the tuning gear isn't going in a straight line. The tree and nut act, or function, as a crude pulley system. (Feel free to correct me if I'm mistaken here...)
     
  19. swiveltung

    swiveltung Member

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    a tree making it easier to bend defies logic to me.... but whatever placebo works!
     
  20. One Chord Wonder

    One Chord Wonder Member

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    If you've got a strat or tele try bypassing the tree and playing, then put it back in place and play it again. It doesn't feel the same when bending.
     

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