Turning down guitar volume pot for cleans... what am I missing??

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by WholeLottaGlove, Jun 10, 2019.

  1. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    Yeah a good fuzz is SO fun to play with the vol knob on. I have one I picked up in the 70's, and it is a ball of soldered parts inside. I don't dare transfer it to a better enclosure, and I dont remember for sure what the name was, but man...that thing cleans up SO well with single coil, just roll it back and I heard suddenly the most like Hendrix rythm sound ever.

    I don't dare gig with it.
     
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  2. mdrake34

    mdrake34 Member

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    The treble bleed circuit in my DGT allows for fantastic volume knob cleanup into my Bassbreaker 15. I can go from R&B rhythm to classic rock crunch with the turn of the knob on my guitar.
     
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  3. GenoVox

    GenoVox Member

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    Yep... I have either treble bleeds or 50s wiring in all my guitars. Most people think of 50s wiring on Gibson-style electronics, but it works great on Fenders too
     
  4. tga-3

    tga-3 Supporting Member

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    Dr. Z Route 66 excels at cleaning up with the guitar volume control...as does a good GE Fuzz Face, like an Analogman NKT 275 White Dot Sunface.
     
  5. VICOwner

    VICOwner Supporting Member

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    I have an amp that cleans up and stays dynamic, it doesn’t loose any brightness when you roll back the volume on your guitar. Roll it back up and man it gets thick.
     
  6. VICOwner

    VICOwner Supporting Member

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  7. rumbletone

    rumbletone Silver Supporting Member

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    Thanks for posting!

    Re no changes to settings, are you saying that the level/EQ/compression were the same during mixing too? To me the clean tone actually sounds louder than the dirty tone, and with more low end, and I don’t see how that’s physically possible unless the level is being raised for the clean tone.

    The reason I ask is that if the initial post is about playing live and just riding the guitar’s volume for clean vs dirt - and just about any amp will get clean if you roll it back far enough - if it’s too quiet to hear when rolled down enough to be completely clean, it’s not much use in a live setting.

    Do you have a raw clip - no changes to the mix/FX/EQ/compression - demonstrating dirty to clean by rolling back the volume? That would be instructive.

     
  8. rumbletone

    rumbletone Silver Supporting Member

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    Sure but that’s not fair because those Trainwreck circuits obviously have magic unicorn dust in them.

    Seriously though - after I have a few more amp builds under my belt I’m going to try to build one - it really does seem to be the perfect circuit for touch sensitive playing. I’ve listened to your clips many times and they really are stunning.

     
  9. Geetarpicker

    Geetarpicker Member

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  10. sah5150

    sah5150 Gold Supporting Member

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    The only thing I did was to raise the fader on the clean track a very small amount in my DAW so the volume was close to even with the doubled dirty track. That's it.

    As far as live goes, I played hundreds of shows in the '80s and only ever rolled the volume off my guitar for cleans. Of course, you are going to lose some overall volume when you roll off the guitar volume to get clean, but the clean parts of songs are usually dynamically lower in volume anyway. If necessary, the engineer at the mixer can also raise the level on the mic'd cab a small amount as well (much like I did in the DAW), so rolling off to clean is perfectly valid live with my amp...

    Once again, we are talking about a small volume rolloff here that doesn't affect the overall volume much.

    Steve
     
  11. ProfRhino

    ProfRhino Member

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    yes, when it comes to PRS, I usually either choose the DGT (not least for its perfect bleed), or a SC with no bleed and 50s wiring.
    two very distinct voices when using the pots, I wouldn't want to be without either.
    ymmv,
    Rhino
     
  12. Gasp100

    Gasp100 Supporting Member

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    Plenty of folks have a clean sound that isn’t. = agreed
     
  13. Gasp100

    Gasp100 Supporting Member

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    Agree!
     
  14. Tootone

    Tootone Member

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    Dunno if OP still following but you can try this, without needing to crank your amp.

    I set this up into a Fender Blues Deluxe set clean/low volume.

    I used a Cali76CD into a TurboRAT but you could probably use any compressor and OD.

    Set up the compressor for a boost (above unity gain) and set for mild to medium compression - not full squash limiting.

    Set the OD up for mild drive. On my TurboRAT I had the Distortion set around 9:30 O'clock, at unity gain.

    With just the RAT engaged I get a nice overdrive sound (just past the "edge of breakup). With the compressor on, feeding into the RAT, I get more of a crunchy sound, approaching lead ...a bit louder but not saturated. The RAT is set a little brighter than normal.

    Now I can use the volume knob on my guitar to go from Heavy Crunch, down to Overdrive, down to Hairy Clean without losing volume or losing treble.

    The compressor is already removing top end direct from the guitar when it is on. As you turn the guitar down, it is driving the OD less so starts to clean up. Also although the guitar is losing treble as you turn it down, the bright OD is restoring it, and compressors treble cut is having less of an effect as the signal is reduced to near or just below its threshold.

    The volume stays the same because because you are only removing compression from the compressor not the OD pedal.

    I get all this on a Strat by going from volume on 10, and turning down to about 8. Past this point it gets quieter and duller... so don't go there.

    Anyway... thought I'd share this if you want to have a go yourself and find a similar balance with your own pedals.
     
  15. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    Very nice writeup on a useful strategy to try!
     
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  16. Pastafarian

    Pastafarian Member

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    Didnt read through the whole thread yet but I will parrot what some of the others said. DIal your amp with your guitar volume rolled back some. May have to go back as far as half way.
     
  17. Phil the Kill Bill V2 guy

    Phil the Kill Bill V2 guy Member

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    In the early 70s I had a 50 watt Marshall head. No master volume.
    With my Les Paul Custom the amp sounded amazing with the volume on 3-4.
    What I did was use the neck pickup on full volume for solos, and the bridge pickup on 6 for clean tones. The treble and prescence knobs were up high on the Marshall to make up up for the lost treble on the guitar. And the full blast neck pickup benefitted from it too.
    Kind of like primitive channel switching.
    Only time I ever did something like that. But it worked well IMO
     
  18. ProfRhino

    ProfRhino Member

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    this. :agree
     
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  19. classicplayer

    classicplayer Member

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    I am just about doing the same thing with my Les Paul into an Orange Dark Terror. Where I don't try to
    copy anyone else's technique or tone, it works wonders because it allows me more freedom to control all from the guitar with only one reverb pedal in the amps' effects loop.


    classicplayer
     
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  20. LPMojoGL

    LPMojoGL Music Room Superstar Supporting Member

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    Many amps clean up well with guitar volume. Any overdriven non master volume Marshall or Fender are great at this. Plenty of master volume amps, too.
    Here is something I recorded this morning, comparing a Naylor to a Wizard. I stay on the dirty channel, just flicking the pickup switch on my LP with the neck pup turned down.



     
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