Using a GSP1101 Just for cabs

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by Kowaii, Feb 17, 2012.

  1. Kowaii

    Kowaii Member

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    I was wondering if anyone knows a way to use only the cabs of the gsp.

    Idea: 11r as main -----> gsp

    Since the 11r cant load irs I've been trying to figure a way to use the gsp just as a cab sim. ( plus effects as well) so i thought why not just turn off the amp sims, but the cabs in the gsp shut off too.

    is there anyway around this?

    any suggestions are greatly appreciated! :p

    im new to the whole modeler thing so please excuse my ignorance XD
     
  2. stratchamp57

    stratchamp57 Member

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    It would be possible and it would probably work and sound good because you can load ir's into it.
     
  3. anslinger

    anslinger Member

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    Try setting the preamp model to "Direct" and then changing the cab. That ought to work.
     
  4. stratchamp57

    stratchamp57 Member

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    Yep, that'll work. ;)
     
  5. drwiddly

    drwiddly Member

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    If you set up the GSP to use the 11r as an outboard pre, then you can set up a patch (or patches) on the GSP that use the 11r as the preamp and add in effects and IR's as you wish.

    If you use the wizard, I think it's setup #6. I regularly use my GSP with outboard preamps and the preamp stages of my tube amps - works great.
     
  6. meambobbo

    meambobbo Member

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    the GSP1101 will downsample any IR loaded onto it from 10,000+ samples to 128 or 256. That's a serious downgrade to the IR's resolution, and it will sound much different on the GSP1101 than it would played on a convulution reverb plugin in a DAW.

    I have yet to find a GSP1101 clip using a loaded IR that impresses me.
     
  7. BCy2k

    BCy2k Member

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    Have you ever A/B'ed any user cab IRs loaded in a GSP1101 with the stock cabs the GSP comes with?
     
  8. drew7000

    drew7000 Member

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    I have.
    The IRs I purchased from RedWirez sound WAY better.
    I wouldn't be using the GSP1101 if I couldn't load the custom IRs.

    I don't care how the GSP1101 "downsamples". None of that matters to me.
    What matters is that the tone is greatly improved on the GSP1101. The custom IRs sound fantastic.
     
  9. BCy2k

    BCy2k Member

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    Oh believe me - I agree with you completely. I don't see how anyone could make the comment I quoted (in my previous post) and have any actual experience with the GSP1101 to begin with. I have all 10 user cab slots filled with a variety of Redwires IRs and they're definitely the icing on the cake if you ask me.

    Out of curiosity - which Redwires IRs did you get?

    I use:

    BASSMAN P10Q
    BOGNER G12T-75
    MARSHALL G12M (best freebee on the web)
    MESA RECTO V30
    ROLAND JC120
    VOX AC30 BLUES ALNICO

    In certain amp combinations - these can be amazing.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2012
  10. 3dognate

    3dognate Supporting Member

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    Here's a quick A/B I just whipped up to demo a built in cab vs a Redwirez Cab. Recorded Direct over USB in Garage Band using a backing track found on the net both left and right tracks are the GSP The left track is the '77 Master Vol model and the right channel is the same '77 Master Vol but with a TS9 added for a little oomph. (I was NOT trying to nail Malcom and Angus' tones...) Both clips use the same patch, guitar only difference is the cabinet model chosen.)

    The GSP cab clip used the Vintage 4x12 cab model and the Redwirez Clip uses the Free Cab with the SM57 cone 2" back (I think).

    GSP1101 Cab
    [SOUNDCLOUD]http://soundcloud.com/3dognate/3dognate-backinblackgspcab[/SOUNDCLOUD]

    Redwirez Cab
    [SOUNDCLOUD]http://soundcloud.com/3dognate/3dognate-backinblackrwzcab[/SOUNDCLOUD]
     
  11. _pete_

    _pete_ Supporting Member

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    Nice!

    I was going to do the exact same thing but you beat me to it.
    I wish I could delete the stock cabs and have more slots open for user cabs.

    I don't really care about sample rates, truncated WAV files, or anything else. I know that using Redwirez makes a HUGE difference in the GSP and it does everything I need a modeler to do.
     
  12. meambobbo

    meambobbo Member

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    i'm not saying the GSP1101 built in cabs sound any better than 3rd party IR's - I wouldn't be surprised at all if the 3rd party sound better all around, as others are saying is their experience. I'm saying if you compare a FULL sample IR being run inside a convolution reverb plugin inside a DAW vs. the same IR loaded (and thus downsampled) inside the GSP1101, the sound will be better for the full-sample IR is processed by your DAW.

    This doesn't mean that any IR loaded into a GSP1101 will sound horrible, just that it may not have as much definition as you're expecting. I personally have not heard a single clip that I feel is high enough quality to regard it as a suitable unit for cab simulation, not matter what IR's I were to load onto it.

    Not to step on toes, but the above clip I feel fits into the category of simply lacking the definition I want from an IR. The mids sound modeled to my ear - quite a bit off from an actual mic'ed 4x12.

    I can't be 100% sure this is the IR quality or simply the GSP's amp modeling, but I'd suspect its the IR quality. Until I hear a clip where the GSP's cabinet modeling gives more midrange and high-end definition, I don't see why I should think otherwise.

    256 samples vs. 2,048 in Axe II vs. 10,000 + in the DAW versions? If those kind of order of magnitude differences had no impact on tone, Fractal wouldn't have doubled the sampling resolution from Axe I to Axe II.

    Disclaimer, I don't have an Axe or a GSP1101. I have a Pod HD500. It also has what I'd call low quality pre-loaded cab sims. I basically run dual tones using different cab/mic combinations to mix two frequency ranges together. I won't claim it sounds as good as using a full-sample IR, but it gets somewhat close. I have no idea how many samples the Pod HD's cab/mic sims use, but I suspect is around or slightly lower than the Axe I. I'm relatively sure it is far higher than the 128 usuable on the GSP for a stereo tone.
     
  13. meambobbo

    meambobbo Member

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    btw, i may have misread this initial post - i thought the OP was asking if the GSP1101 was worth getting just to use as an IR loader. For the price, yes, it would work well for that purpose. i was just trying to warn people that assumed it would work as well as say the torpedo units or the Axe FX's or even a cheap laptop.

    By all means if you already have an 11R and a GSP1101, it may indeed sound better to run the GSP1101 loading 3rd party IR's than using the 11R's built-in cabs. I don't know for sure.
     
  14. Will Chen

    Will Chen Member

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    Hate to say it, but that's the thing that's keeping me from trying the GSP1101. When you load up IRs in say Revalver, the impact on the tone is beyond EQ coloration and you can really hear the comb filtering from off axis placement and the way certain resonant frequencies pop out, very realistic. While the IR samples from the GSP I've heard have offered varying degrees of improvement, I'm not hearing incredible leaps forward in realism. And while many have commented that the correct IR also improves the feel of the models, I have my reservations about that as well.

    Got that right. Once one's messed with a any good convolution plugin and some IRs on a computer, its not a competition. No floorboard option in the ~$500 comes close to the level of realism on can achieve with a nice high quality IR. IMHO, this is the target floorboard makers should be targeting at this point. That's not to say any/all of the more affordable amp modeling solutions don't sound good, I think they pretty much all do. But the lack of HQ IR implementation is what pushes me to use these devices to the return of my TM 60 rather than direct to an FRFR.
     
  15. 3dognate

    3dognate Supporting Member

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    Well, I think that we can determine that Cabinet IR is probalby the weakest link in the GSP and most modelers. Even with low res IRs there is a HUGE improvement in tone and amp-like-ed-ness between the GSP cab and RedWirez cab in the two clips I posted.

    And while it's probably not quite where we'd like it... That patch I used for the clip sounds like a big ol fat wall o'Marshall through a good PA at show volumes and feels really good and like a good amp is really honest about your playing. I just got an RCF ART 312A for an FRFR monitor and the GSP sounds quite nice through it, Very much like our full PA.

    But the feature set and I/O on the GSP1101 is very complete... and keeps me using it versus the other sub $1k modelers.
     
  16. Will Chen

    Will Chen Member

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    I'm not denying the improvement over many of the stock cabs (though I bet the ALT 2X12 with some judicious EQ could close the gap in the your demo) and agree the second sounds much better than the first. My point is simply once tasting the difference between built in cabs and a HQ IR (by running a unit w/ no cab modeling into my sound card and applying the cab using a VST), if the GSP didn't sound the same I know I would be very disappointed. There are other reasons keeping me away as well. I'll probably give in to curiosity and try it one day but I'm trying to stave that temptation as I still have a glimmer of hope that Digitech will be releasing a new line of (non-iPad) units in the near future...
     
  17. Aydan

    Aydan Member

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    I;m actually shocked by the imprevement of the tone using that IR. Jeez man makes me consider a GSP1101. But then Digitech have confirmed new multi-fx in the future so I'll wait and see.
     
  18. _pete_

    _pete_ Supporting Member

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    No, you'd lose that bet. ;)

    The difference between my RP1000 using factory IR's and my GSP using Redwirez (through the same power amp/speakers) is startling.
    No amount of tweaking has closed that gap.
     
  19. mattball826

    mattball826 Member

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    ive heard impressive results too with an ext eq in the loop of the gsp to shape the redwirez or ownhammers irs. my bud has an old yam spx90 and eq he adds a slight mix via the loop. its sounds great too.
     
  20. Will Chen

    Will Chen Member

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    I'll try one sooner or later. Last night I plugged up my RP500 after a pretty long hiatus (been using my HD500 a bunch) and boy do I miss a bunch about it...and its so easy to dial in. You mention through the same power amp/speakers. I assume your playing FRFR, correct?
     

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