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Volume levels in today's scene

mikebat

Member
Messages
10,982
I am using either a "1000 watt" FRFR with a digital rig, or my 100 watt all tube PWE into an oversized 2x12.

I have no problem with a lower wattage amp, but I cannot stand a speaker that cannot handle the workload and is sh!tting it's pants out as soon as you turn a 20 watt amp up. This is the main reason I never liked small Fender amps.
 

meterman

Member
Messages
7,890
30-50w 2x12 run clean with pedals, almost always single coils. I can't get the clean headroom I need with smaller amps and I think big amps sound better, fuller even at lower volumes. Small amps are great for overdriven tones but if you need a big clean sound that cuts through a band 15w won't do it. A sound man occasionally asks me to turn down but otoh this is the first band that I have ever been in where they actually ask me to turn up.
 
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C-4

Member
Messages
13,498
I have never had a problem using 100 watt Marshalls and Diezel's with even more wattage like a VH4 or Herbert.
However my age having been the cause for less weighty amp heads has brought me down to what I "thought" would be plenty of wattage in a Marshall Mini Jubilee. While I truly love the sound of it, both clean and dirty, our band has me now pushing that amp at close to or at max, so I am going back to a 50 watt Marshall and Pleximan.
Had I known this was coming when I bought the Mini Jubilee, I would have opted for either a Marshall Astoria Dual, or a 50 watt Jubilee.
 

AintNoEddie

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
553
Definitely not a question of W. Had 50-100 W amps, then I got myself an 18W budda. Realized I can't open it up any further than the higher wattage models. So I am back to 50-100W amps. Could not find any < 5W amp that I dig for gigs.
Good MV just solves the problem. I see the challange for NMV amps, but for these there are so many attenuator choices available these days...
To answer the initial question: usually smaller sized gigs, 20-100 people. Volume level to match the drumset, even if there is always a PA system.
 

Aslan

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
2,578
Got rid of my big amps 5 years ago, gig with a Fender 57 Custom Deluxe, killer tones at sane levels. The 5E3 circuit is the foundation of rock & roll!


Occasionally, I just use a tweed fender champ & a Fly Rig 5 V2, mic the amp into the PA, surprising how good it sounds.
 

PretzelLogic

Member
Messages
88
I gig with a Mesa Boogie Fillmore 25 combo and a Marshall Origin 20h into an Egnater Rebel 1x12 cab - played at the same time, mic'd through the PA. I run some dirt pedals (Wampler Tumnus and Wampler Clarksdale) through the Marshall. I use just a boost and an occasional compressor with the Fillmore. Volume wise (at gigs), both amps haven't been above 12:00 and I get all I need and want. I'm absolutely satisfied with my rig !!
 

Papanate

Member
Messages
19,872
But...what are you using, where (capacity) and at what volume? I am running a Katana 50 at half on the 25 watt position. Guitars are single coil-equipped and no pedals.
I am currently a advocate of silent stages in this day and age. I want drummers to use Electronic Kits, Bass & Guitar Players to use Modelers
with minimal volume for onstage monitoring - and keyboard players to keep going direct. Bands should have In-Ears - and system engineers should have 3 to 4 ambient microphones to feed the In Ears for comfort levels.
 

meterman

Member
Messages
7,890
That's the KEY. You NEED to be THAT loud. And no louder. And if your amp doesnt sound great to you at THAT volume, you need a different amp.
Yeah this is it exactly it's all about getting the right stage volume relative to the drums and bass. To complicate things I very much prefer to hear myself from my amp and not coming back at me from the monitors, I find that brittle sounding and I think causes phase issues depending on where I'm standing. The solution seems to be to tilt the amp back so I can hear it how I want it without beaming the audience and the sound man.

I will say this, in my younger days I was more worried about being not loud enough than being too loud, but now I've come to realize that being too loud really ruins the mix for all the other instruments and especially the vocals. On the one hand I can't really get into it if it is not just a little bit loud, but at the same time I'm being paid to entertain and it's not just about me. Gotta find that right balance.
 

bluesoul

Member
Messages
4,663
But...what are you using, where (capacity) and at what volume? I am running a Katana 50 at half on the 25 watt position. Guitars are single coil-equipped and no pedals.
What ever I need to keep up with the drummer and nothing beyond! 50 watt JCM 800 is needed a lot of the time but I have a few 20 watt amps that i try to use....20 watts barely makes it with a loud drummer. Most of the time only vocals are miked. I am experimenting with one main 20 watt amp and running a second 20 watter just to get a little extra volume. it is a challenge to be loud enough but not too loud!
 

rickt

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
2,072
Swart AST is usually what I bring. Volume knob at the 8 or 9 o'clock position.
 

tonedover

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
5,655
if they serve food, and its before 9pm, youre too loud for half the crowd and annoying them more than ur pleasing the half that is open to your playing
never been in a “bar and grill” with a guy / band that wasnt playing too loud.

i think many of us want to do the gig “correctly” so bad we forget that portions of the audience dont want us there in the first place.

just some random thoughts after seeing some live bar acts the past couple weeks. this one guy was so loud we sat in the back and were still yelling at the waitress our burger order. a huge group of young attractive people looking like they had $$ showed up and left after 20 minutes bc the girls were blatantly complaining how loud the dude was. the manager behind the bar looked pissed and i think he told dude to turn down. we finally escaped to patio seating outside

we as a community need to ensure we are not a nuisance in the public, non-ticketed venues we play, while living out our fantasy of playing for others... its what will continue to crush the local live music scenes. anymore it seems its not “hey! they have a band!” its more like “ugh... there is a band here”
 

jayn

Member
Messages
980
I've been at 12-22W for years. Princeton non-verb - DRRI - Magic Brit - AST Pro - AC15. Always asked to turn down with volume on 9 - 10 o'clock. That's one reason why I use a AC15C1 most of the time. The boutique amps aren't worth it if you can't get them to where they shine. I'm even looking for an AC10C1 at this point.
 

JDandCoke

Member
Messages
1,946
Most of my gigs are a JTM45 into closed 2x12 run up around 6 on both volumes. Attenuated 3db.
On really small stuff (the kind where there aren't even crowd barriers) I'll run the 2061x around 4 on the volume into the same 2x12. In REALLY small places like cafes or whatever I'll also attenuate the 2061x down 3db.

A few years ago I used to just point my speakers straight to the front of the stage, blasting the audience and soundie, since I've learned that's a sure fire way to be told to turn down, I now point my speakers sideways across stage and I can crank up the amp far more without any complaints. We still use acoustic drums so I just let the PA do the work of letting the audience hear me.

Other guitarist in my band uses a DRRI set clean and tends to face his amp towards the front. If ever there's a complaint about guitar volume it's him every time. Despite being lower power, set cleaner, half as many speakers and an open cab.


I've also learned that the majority of soundies really aren't as good as I used to give them credit for. If I turn on a pedal that SOUNDS loud, like a fuzz, but set the volume to be significantly lower than bypassed, I get told to turn down. Turn it off (and volume goes up) and suddenly it's fine. Go figure.
 

meterman

Member
Messages
7,890
A lot of it obviously depends on style too. If you play metal people are expecting it to be loud. If you play blues a cranked up small tweed is perfect. If you need versatility to cover multiple styles an amp with plenty of clean headroom that also takes dirt and fuzz pedals well is the way to go, 50w plexi style with master volume in my case.
 
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Just Mike

Member
Messages
395
For us old guys that got to gig the barns back in the 70's-80's, it's hard to dial it back once you know what a Marshall sounds and feels like when it's "in the zone". I've been buying and trying, experimenting with amps and pedals for a lot of years, but when I plug into my 2204 and a 4-12 cab, it just has the sound. For smaller gigs, I turn the cabinet around and use monitors. Even when I use my DSL40c, it just sounds better when the master is past 5. And attenuators don't work. Part of the sound is VOLUME. Electric guitar and amp is a system.
 




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