Wah id/tb options

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by jaywalker, Sep 24, 2008.

  1. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    just dug out an old (aledged)vintage crybaby super

    here's the visuals on it:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    iIve spent the past few hours searching for a schematic to TB it (although it doesn't look like all the original components are still there).
    It says crybaby super on the tin, but being that I payed next to nothing for it 20 years ago it could be anything.
    i love the sound of this wah and want to get it TBed tonight if poss!!
    Thanks for any input.
     
  2. Roobin

    Roobin Member

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    Well, if you want to TB it, you're going to need a DPDT switch or a 3PDT (if you want a LED). The green wire is 'in' to the effect. The white is 'out jack'. The yellow is 'out effect'. As it is wired, it isn't true bypass. It has a DPST switch. To make it true bypass with a DPDT:

    - the switch will look like:

    | | 1 2
    | | 3 4
    | | 5 6

    - Remove the green wire from the in jack to the in of the effect (ie the shorter green wire). Desolder the green wire from where the switch and solder onto pole 3 of the switch.
    - Desolder the white wire from the switch, and resolder it to pole 4
    - Solder a piece of wire between poles 1 & 2
    - Solder a wire from pole 5 to where the green wire was attached to on the effect board
    - Desolder the yellow wire from the switch and solder it onto pole 6 of the switch

    That will make it TB. BTW does it even work?

    For maintenance, you may want to replace those wires with tape on them.
     
  3. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    thanks roobin,
    actually it works great, not scratchy at all and it has an almost vox charachter to it.
    I was woried about the fact that certain things have been changed, wires etc.
    I've just picked up a whole load of 3PDT switches and I'm going to do my bottom glow thingy on it instead of the classic LED like this:
    [​IMG]

    Just need to think of a suitable colour for a wah.....
    It's also going to be refinished in chrome with go faster stripes.
     
  4. Roobin

    Roobin Member

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    Man, that'll look super cool! Also, you might want to measure that electrolytic cap - they can drain slowly over time (esp 20 years!). Is this going on the green pedalboard? (which btw looks fantastic!) Is that your CE2?
     
  5. GBlekas

    GBlekas Supporting Member

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    What you have their is an original Cry Baby wah with a Fasel inductor in it.
    The small sqaure board was only used for the first few years of production and my favorite.

    If you notice the input, green wire, to the board is a very short run and doesn't add enough capacitance to the circuit and thus cuts highs to a minimal extent.
    A true bypass mod is needed less than replacing the jacks and wiring up the power properly. The ground wire from the DC power jack and battery snap should go to the input jack ring connection and the shield connection of the input jack should go to the ground of both the board and the chassis ground. This is the one connected to the chassis by a screw and goes to one end of the wah pot. BTW, the wah pot is an original Icar pot and the best there is when working properly.

    When adding DC power jack one should have filtering, preferably a 220uf cap, as well as polarity protection added to the circuit.

    The two .01 caps and 4.7 uf electro do not appear to be original.

    Cool pedal...nice find! :AOK

    Regards,
    George


    [​IMG]
     
  6. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    It's not the one from the green board, that ones already TBed. This is one I used in the 80s.
    All the light saber plazma base pedals are going on this:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I ran a thread on the LED plasma thing a while back - here's the basics:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    That's my old CE2. The plasma mods are incredibly cheap and don't damage the pedal in any way whatsoever, and they look great, especially on the chrome boards.
    With the wah I might even try to get the colour to change with the sweep of the way, but I'll need a decent split pot to achieve that probably.
     
  7. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    :eek:

    I asumed that because it looks nothing like my other crybaby super inside that it was a fake or had been butchered!
    It's in the exact same form it was when I bought it, never even needed to replace the pot.
    Would love to know how old it is. I got it from a friends second hand shop when I was 14 (eons ago) and it had had only one previous owner (still have the box and reciept but back in england).
    This one has seen a lot of action but handles everything perfectly. I taped up the power jack because it kept falling out (as usual).
    so maybe I shouldn't butcher this one you think??
     
  8. Roobin

    Roobin Member

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    +1 on the power supply filtering & polarity protection. Every so often I plug in a power jack that's reversed...and it still works:) That's assuming you want to mod it.

    With TB, it isn't the length of wire that causes loss of high end - it's the fact that the effect is always connected to the input, and acts as one giant load. The crybaby's input impedance is low compared to modern pedals. This low input impedance will reduce the treble content. By completely taking it out of the circuit, all you have is a few bits of wire effectively - no more impedance problems.

    If it's going on the metal board, white could be quite a cool LED colour - are you painting the pedal itself?
     
  9. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    I'm not sure i want to do anything to it now.......
    don't know if it might be worth something in the end as it is.

    anyone know of a way to date/value it???
     
  10. GBlekas

    GBlekas Supporting Member

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    The pedal is worth less due to the drilling that added the DC power jack.
    The small caps appear to be 80-85' vintage and not original.
    The 4.7 uf electrolytic is not original.
    The large Box film caps are not vintage either.
    The 33k accross the inductor is not in the typical spot for that board layout.

    Bottom line is this could end up being a great sounding wah but it won't have the collector value due to the various changes.

    So, correcting the deficiencies would make it more road worthy and better for the pedal over all.
     
  11. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    Thanks for that, I think I'll just clean it up and rewire it then. I'll leave it as it is with a TB.
    It is a great sounding wah, I've just A/B'd it with my newer (20 year old) crybaby, I must say that I like the sound of this one better, definately more traditional.

    Not sure about the power input though. It seems like its been there all along going on the fact that there is no chipping or scratching on either side of the tin. Could be a hybrid that the guy made for himself. Guess we'll never know.
    The reciept just says 'wah wah pedal', and it's from a shop in Middlesbrough England somewhere, the date is too faded to read I've just heard.
     
  12. GBlekas

    GBlekas Supporting Member

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    [​IMG]

    Notice the caps, inductor and resistor on top of the input cap.
    These parts are 1967 era.
    This is a Clyde McCoy patent pending wah.


    Here is another wah from roughly the same era.
    Notice the color of the inductor.
    Most were a reddish/brown color.
    This board appears to have had the electrolytic replaced.

    [​IMG]

    Also notice darker pcbs as well.
    One pcb has carbon film and the other has carbon comps.

    Your board is most curious as it's color is throwing me off as is the color of the inductor.

    If you want to add the 220uf filtering cap it's easy to do at the lugs on the board. Spin them onto the lugs and then the diode and you are almost there. A 1k resistor off the power lead to the power post and you are done with that end of things.

    I hope the pix helped.

    Regards,
    George
     
  13. Scottone

    Scottone Supporting Member

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    I've owned at least 4 or 5 of these over the years and they are really nice wahs. I've had them with red, white, and green inductors. Circuit board looks original to me.
     
  14. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    Guys, I just tried to TB the wah as per the circuit, maybe I'm a dumb ass, but it aint working (decided to loose the battery input and havn't started on the grounding issues yet)

    See anything wrong here (I'm a novice so don't shout!!!)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  15. xntrick

    xntrick Member

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    your wah is older than mine, and when i tried to by a true bypass kit on ebay i was told it wouldn't work with my REV C board..i take it that is a yellow fasel on your board..i replace mine with a red inductor and did the vocal mod as well and it has certainly improved the sound..this page might give you the info you're after:

    http://fulltone.com/vox6080.html
     
  16. jaywalker

    jaywalker Member

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    Thanks for that, I'll try it in the morning.
    ****! I've just snapped the bloody plastic toothey thingy in two!!!!! Damn.....
    Anyone know how hard they are to find????
     
  17. GBlekas

    GBlekas Supporting Member

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    Try Small Bear for a replacement


    Regards,
    George
     

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