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We are in a Recession/Depression RIGHT?

robbph37

Member
Messages
291
I had to share this. I am currently looking for another Charvel guitar. I want something kind of cool with a nice birdseye neck on it. I like weird colors and I have seen a lot of cool Charvels that catch your eye. I just purchased a US series that plays like a dream. I figured I would get another one. This time I would like to spend a little more and get a birdseye neck as well. I call a well known Charvel dealer. They stock a lot of Charvels and have had some on Ebay for sale for many months with no activity. Now I knew when I called that I would not get a fire sale price and that was not my intention. I did hope to get a better deal than list price. I spoke to a salesman and he was very nice but when I explained that I could not pay retail he shut down pretty fast. His reply was " No we don't have any room on the higher end Charvels." Now my question is if that is true then how in the world are these companies surviving right now? Maybe its worse in my area (Kentucky) but I dont see many people paying straight list for music gear right now. I realize all music stores have the right to set there prices but again when you have someone interested in making a purchase how do you let that person get away without making some kind of effort?
 

rabbuhl

Member
Messages
2,881
What you are describing is a poor sales experience. So, call the guy back, tell him you are serious about buying, and name your price. Try to negotiate the price your want or find another shop where the saleman is willing to negotiate on price.

Note that an economic depression "is a severe economic downturn that lasts several years." An economic recession occurs when "GDP growth slows". People will continue to buy musical instruments during these periods but you are right that lack of demand "should" cause prices to fall.
http://useconomy.about.com/od/grossdomesticproduct/f/Depression.htm
http://useconomy.about.com/od/grossdomesticproduct/f/Recession.htm
 

robbph37

Member
Messages
291
I hear what you are saying. It just shocked me that there was no sense of urgency to make a sale. Again I did not expect to get a $2600 guitar from a dealer for $1400. I was looking for a reason to buy it new from a dealer who wanted to make a sale. Now I'll just be patient and wait for the right one to come along on the used market. I believe this current economic problem will last longer than 2009. I hope for us all that I am wrong.
 

jojobean39

Member
Messages
226
It also depends on what the dealer has in the guitar. If he has $2,200 in a guitar, he won't take less than that. I know that sounds obvious, but it's something to consider. I imagine the new guitar market has to be absolutely dying right now with the great prices on used gear. I suspect if you wait it out, you can get a killer deal on a used one.
 

markw1980

Member
Messages
1,028
I have to agree that discounted items are moving faster right now, however, lots of companies (maybe including Charvel) have clauses in their dealer contracts that will not allow the dealers to list discounted prices in print or to even say them over the phone. If you were standing in the store, they might be able to deal. Just a thought. It's because of clauses like that prevent Musician's Friend and other catalog stores from printing prices.
 

randomhitz

Member
Messages
218
It's been years since I worked in a music store, but my sense is that dealers are will to take a loss on high end items if they need to free up the money to invest in inventory that is in a price range that moves better. Another factor is that if the instrument is "floored" by the manufacturer that means the dealer has a certain amount of time to sell it before having to pay for it. If it's been on the rack for say a year, the flooring agerrement should be running out. The other factor is dealers know that when guitar players get a gas attack especially for a high end instrument, it's a hard thing to shake so the customer might likely be back at the higher price. I agree with the poster above that said make a reasonble offer. You can count on the discount to the dealer from the manufacturer to be somewhere in the 25-40% percent range. I would suspect something closer to 25% for a charvel.
 

ripoffriffs

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
3,142
Hey Mesa amps are never discounted, and yet they remain in business and going strong (whether you like their amps or not) with new products in the pipeline.

The best thing to do is buy used. Guitars are better used than new.
 

edgewound

Member
Messages
5,712
The salesman should have asked you to come in to the store. If you're a serious buyer with funds in hand, you can make a deal somewhere below list...but not below cost unless they're desperate.

Why should he give you shopping ammo over the phone?
 

rob2001

Member
Messages
16,929
What I don't get is why everyone thinks stuff should be discounted because of the economy. I'm all for getting the best deal possible but just because times are tough, you can't expect retailers to give stuff away at cost or below. They would for sure be out of business with that practice.
 

robbph37

Member
Messages
291
I agree that if I could go to the store that I would. Problem is the store is in NY. Long drive from KY. I was not looking for at cost prices to those who may have that idea. All I am saying is there was not a lot of interest in making a sale. Dont tell me they have no room on a $2600 guitar. I own 2 businesses so I understand profit margin but I also understand that a sale with smaller profit is better than no sale at all in tough economic times.
 

getbent

Member
Messages
4,305
recession should not be perceived as yet another new entitlement to low price.

this thinking has been prevalent, but it needs to end.
 

edgewound

Member
Messages
5,712
I agree that if I could go to the store that I would. Problem is the store is in NY. Long drive from KY. I was not looking for at cost prices to those who may have that idea. All I am saying is there was not a lot of interest in making a sale. Dont tell me they have no room on a $2600 guitar. I own 2 businesses so I understand profit margin but I also understand that a sale with smaller profit is better than no sale at all in tough economic times.
What'd you expect? You called New York and expected patience and a homey attitude? A buyer with cash might've walked in and bought your gem with no hassle of packing and shipping. Lots of musicians in NY.

Call another dealer.
 

webe123

Member
Messages
1,397
What you are describing is a poor sales experience. So, call the guy back, tell him you are serious about buying, and name your price. Try to negotiate the price your want or find another shop where the saleman is willing to negotiate on price.

Note that an economic depression "is a severe economic downturn that lasts several years." An economic recession occurs when "GDP growth slows". People will continue to buy musical instruments during these periods but you are right that lack of demand "should" cause prices to fall.
http://useconomy.about.com/od/grossdomesticproduct/f/Depression.htm
http://useconomy.about.com/od/grossdomesticproduct/f/Recession.htm

No.... HE SHOULD NOT CALL THAT GUY BACK!

The sales person was obviously at fault. He did not care about doing what he could to make a sale he first time he was asked, so what in the world makes you think he would even care the second time he was asked?

You frankly, seem to think all salesman are the same! They are NOT! Some are real jerks. And you also seem to be placing blame on the original poster when he was obviously serious about buying.

My advice to the OP is to go somewhere else!

With this economy, no need to put up with idiocy like that.

There are a lot of Charvel dealers that would be more than glad to serve you, so vote with your wallet. Take your business elsewhere where you can be treated like you are supposed to be, instead of putting up with nonsense from a sales guy that seems he could care less if he had your business or not.
 

robbph37

Member
Messages
291
What'd you expect? You called New York and expected patience and a homey attitude? A buyer with cash might've walked in and bought your gem with no hassle of packing and shipping. Lots of musicians in NY.

Call another dealer.
That's the plan! I am sure one will become available soon on the used market. Again I called about a guitar and was surprised that there was no urgency to make a profit. I can't believe Charvel would be that high to dealers but I could be wrong. 25% would not give a salesman much room to bargain with.
 

openbar

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
1,961
recession should not be perceived as yet another new entitlement to low price.

this thinking has been prevalent, but it needs to end.
And that's gotten us into this mess we're in now. Everyone thinks everything should be free or dirt cheap, you can thank napster or whoever. Trying to avoid talking politics, but...

Thouhg no offense to the OP, because I kinda agree with him - the salesman should've been willing to at least talk.
 

Beauhooligan

Member
Messages
85
I had to share this. I am currently looking for another Charvel guitar. I want something kind of cool with a nice birdseye neck on it. I like weird colors and I have seen a lot of cool Charvels that catch your eye. I just purchased a US series that plays like a dream. I figured I would get another one. This time I would like to spend a little more and get a birdseye neck as well. I call a well known Charvel dealer. They stock a lot of Charvels and have had some on Ebay for sale for many months with no activity. Now I knew when I called that I would not get a fire sale price and that was not my intention. I did hope to get a better deal than list price. I spoke to a salesman and he was very nice but when I explained that I could not pay retail he shut down pretty fast. His reply was " No we don't have any room on the higher end Charvels." Now my question is if that is true then how in the world are these companies surviving right now? Maybe its worse in my area (Kentucky) but I dont see many people paying straight list for music gear right now. I realize all music stores have the right to set there prices but again when you have someone interested in making a purchase how do you let that person get away without making some kind of effort?
Right, we are in a recession, and stores do want to make sales. But we also need to make enough profit to make payroll, pay the utilities and the rest of the monthly nut; and what the boss jokingly considers profit. We can cut, but only so deep. Then there is the problem with phone sales. We do not have a catalog or website, just three doors that customers can walk in and out of, so calls from out of State never happen. So we get a lot of, "Do you have...?" calls, and if we do the price we give out is the price on the hanger tag; the same price someone who walks in the door gets to see. We will also offer to order anything that we can get from our suppliers, but to get us to place an order, you have to come down to the store and, probably, place a deposit. We don't dicker price on the phone. If the customer says, "But JoJo's Guitar and Skate has it for $50 less!", I say, "Say hi to JoJo and drop by some time and tell us how things are going," because I can't drop the price to match. I know that JoJo is a flake that is about to go under, and that he does not service anything he sells. If the guy had come into the store, found an instrument he enjoyed, we would have cut the price off the hanger tag generously, as much as the Boss will allow, and an equally sweet deal on case, strap, whatever. And, as long as he doesn't break the guitar in half while skate boarding, we will take care of his guitar for much longer than the warranty date. We just refuse to dicker price over the phone. Too many of the calls are from people who are wishers, not buyers, and I can't dicker on the phone with someone I'll probably never see, while I have flesh and blood customers waiting. I'll go and check stock, and quote the hanger tag, but when it comes to dickering it's, "Come on down and we'll give you a good deal". That's about the best any local guitar seller can really do.:cool:
 




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