What are Garageband's limitations compared to Logic Express?

Discussion in 'Recording/Live Sound' started by rotren, Mar 10, 2008.

  1. rotren

    rotren Member

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    Just got a new MacBook Pro and I'm lovin' it. :dude

    I find GarageBand very sweet too - so quick to get something going!

    Now, I hear people say Logic Express is so much more professional.

    My goal is to produce some good sounding demos with virtual drums, my guitar and my bass and vocals. I have a Line 6 Toneport. Do I need to get Logic Express in order to get a professional sounding demo?

    Why are the drawbacks and limitations of GarageBand compared to Logic Express?
     
  2. theHoss

    theHoss Member

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    The number of real instrument tracks is limited to 8 in GB. Logic allows more than that. In your situation this might not be a problem because you are using virtual instruments.

    As I understand it, Logic offers a greater degree of fine tuning. You can always start out with GB and then move to logic later. I am pretty sure you can import a GB project into Logic?

    GB is pretty powerful and icing on the cake for us musicians!
     
  3. brads

    brads Supporting Member

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    Biggest problem with Garageband is you can't demarcate an automatic punch in and punch out section to fix a mistake. You have to record the correction on another track and cut and paste it.

    Otherwise, it's great!
     
  4. chad c

    chad c Member

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    If you have a new mac that means you must have Garageband 08 which means both of the previous responders info is no longer valid..... You can only record 8 tracks at once but you can use as many as your machine can handle. You can also punch in certain parts just loop record the bars you want and when you are done it will give you a click down option for each of the new takes. I have used Logic quite a bit but with thew new Garageband I find it gives me enough to productive with it. Logic has so many more options that I spent more time mixing and producing, with Garageband I just record of course YMMV.
     
  5. scottlr

    scottlr Member

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    For me, the biggest limitation was the number of effect slots in the master track (GB)/outputs 1&2 (LE). GB only gives you one effect slot there. LE gives you all you need. GB is easier to learn to use, but LE isn't at all bad once you get to know it. GB is a great place to start before you move into LE.
     
  6. theHoss

    theHoss Member

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    Thanks for the info on this, just another reason to get a new mac. As if I don't have a good case of MAS already.

     
  7. syxxstring

    syxxstring Member

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    You could just buy the new Ilife suite, Hoss.
     
  8. theHoss

    theHoss Member

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    Yeah I looked into that, but my old 12" Mac Book doesn't meet the minimum reqs.
     
  9. brads

    brads Supporting Member

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    This is a bit misleading. It's true in Garageband 08 you can make a loop and record over it again and again, and then select which take you want. The problem is it just plays the loop segment repeatedly, but with no lead-in capability like you would get with pre-set punch-ins.

    So on tight editing segments, there's no lead-in. You're left trying to jump from your mouse or trackpad to your guitar, or have the loop start recording a new take immediately after the previous take is finished. You can't rewind (so to speak) to a place well in front of the edit spot, and jam along to get into the feel of it, and have it automatically start and stop recording where you've marked, like a standard punch-in feature.
     
  10. proreverb68

    proreverb68 Member

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    I'm making the transition to Logic 8 express..

    I still use garageband while Im learning the ins and outs of Logic but seriously...
    If you have patience...and you know it if you dont!

    it isn't that much harder to use once you get a few basic commands down.

    If you just like to record yourself and not think much abut it more than that go with garageband.

    If you decide to go with logic 8 in any form...I recommend the apple training series book on logic 8 and logic express 8.

    Apple is really putting out world class tools for creative people.

    It was written in a very organized manner and it translates well as you do the lessons with the included DVD/cd of info and files.
     
  11. rotren

    rotren Member

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    Proreverb68, what do you feel are the major benefits with Logic Express compared to Garageband?
     
  12. proreverb68

    proreverb68 Member

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    benefits...
    THere is alot more to logic(you will benefit from a quick glance at the manuals online or even the adds for logic and express on the apple page- I think they have a comparison chart?)
    For one...
    Well, I can actually create drum beats of my own. I have not done this yet as I am really new at this and have not gotten to that page yet in the book.
    (ultra beat)

    I get a lot more instruments to use with a keyboard. Including all the drum kits that I can actually use and make hand made loops and sections with.
    YOU WILL GET TIRED OF THE APPLE DRUM LOOPS IN ABOUT A YEAR>...being able to build your own is worth the 200 bucks alone for me.
    If your into downtempo, rap or techno or modern computer music...it's honestly not a contest.
    The final mixing/editing tools are superior beyond a doubt. More control in nearly every area.
    The tools for correcting errors or getting in there and dealing with midi instruments is by far superior.
    It is going to work quicker with all the key functions and real production enhancing tools.
    You can do more/quicker in logic.

    ...but then a Dodge 2 ton truck can carry more than a Honda civic. It also costs twice as much. It is about what YOU need it for. It is about what you realistically do or will do with your recordings.

    If you are commuting back and forth to work...the 2 ton truck is over kill.
    If you just want to get a good sound on your guitar and voice...Garage band is good enough. (all my recordings on my page are Garageband and a little om-2 dynamic mic) Good enough for a demo and for my learning process but I want to get more serious about it and have upgraded since then in some areas.

    I got a few books etc about recording and plan to get into it seriously. For that Logic is going to be were I need to be.

    It really depends on what you REALLY do with your recordings.

    If you intend to someday be serious about recording, and getting into it and mixing and engineering. Garage band will be a nice intro absolutely, but it isn't as serious a recording tool for the professional.

    Im not a pro at recording but hope to eventually bring myself into that realm. Any program can teach you all sorts of things...the more you do it the more you learn that you dont know.
    Things like where to put teh vocals in the mix, where to put mics, Mastering, compression, peak limits etc...the more you learn the more you may realize that logic will allow you to grow into it. etc etc..

    Im sure there are pro engineers who can do things with garage band that would blow a novice in a million dollar studio away...depends on what you do and how good you are with it.

    Its much like a guitar. Give Charlie Christian a Sears and Roebucks guitar and he can outplay the Joe with the 4000 jazz box.

    That said...Logic will take you further if you want to go there.
    Garage band is plenty good for demos but either way there's a learning curve to recording or we would all be producing for Sony.

    You don't need logic for a professional sounding recording as much as you/I need skills or knowledge of how to get that recording sounding professional no matter what you/we use.

    P.S///I dug the playing on your site! Nice tones and sounds!
     
  13. FractalGarden

    FractalGarden Member

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    Like many, I started with GB and was hooked, but within 6 months, I was yearning for more. LE7 was more, and then some. A definite learning curve, and hardly intuitive, but the end result was much more polished than what I could do in GB. LE8 has a better interface, but has lots of tricks for accessing menus. Click-and-hold and right-click opens up a new world of options.

    I still find Logic maddening to use. For me, it's cumbersome to use to lay down ideas, and when I'm in that zone, and feel that urgency to 'get it recorded,' I've often yearned for a simpler tool. But the production tools it has are fabulous, and the end result is what keeps me using it.
     
  14. Orren

    Orren Member

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    Not to state the obvious, but why not start the loop x number of bars before the point you want to record? Then you get your lead in.

    To me, that's the way to do it.

    Orren
     
  15. Orren

    Orren Member

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    Nah. ;) Admittedly, I've written books on Logic, and I'm a moderator of the Logic forums in the Big Blue Lounge and Logic User Group, so I'm a little more familiar with it. But once you find your "rhythm" in Logic, especially Logic 8, it becomes pretty intuitive.

    The best advice I can give you is to set up an Arrange and Mixer—maybe even editors—exactly the way you like it. You want to have 8 tracks for guitars? Set them up. A few instruments? Configure them. You like some drum loops waiting for you? Put them on a track. Etc. Then save it as a Template.

    At that point, every time you start Logic, just select your Template as your new song, and everything will automatically be set up exactly the way you like it when you're in the zone. :)

    Orren
     
  16. brads

    brads Supporting Member

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    Because it starts recording where you start your loop. So, if you start the loop several bars before the part you want fixed, you're just going to wipe out those bars and have dead space leading up to the part you want to fix.

    I wish I was wrong on this but I haven't found a way to do auto punch-ins.
     
  17. Orren

    Orren Member

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    Right...but...so what? It takes three seconds in Garageband to do that:
    1) Set your loop x bars ahead
    2) Record as many loops as you want
    3) Position the cursor at the actual start of the position you want fixed
    4) Press the key command for "Split"

    Really, it may sound like extra work, but you'll find that in practice, it's very quick and easy to do.

    See, but I'd recommend the above no matter what application you're using. I just don't like the idea of punch ins when you're using hard disk recording. Why erase something when you can just record a new version? That way, you don't risk ruining an already recorded take. Obviously, I use Logic, which has all the punch-in facilities you could want, and I never use them—I'd rather just loop record to get it right, trim the loop, and then play the improved region instead of the previous part.

    Orren
     
  18. trisonic

    trisonic Member

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    I've got the most up to date version of Garageband.

    I've got a test recording I did comprising 20 tracks of full orchestration. If someone wants to post it in this thread I'll gladly email it in Mp4 format for whoever to post. It's fully copyright protected. Did I say on this thread earlier? - I'm doing a Soundtrack using just Garageband ('cos I'm not being paid) so far it's a breeze...

    Best, Pete.
     
  19. brads

    brads Supporting Member

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    Just so I understand this: What happens after you split? Don't you still have the bars preceding the split point as blank? Since you've recorded over said bars?
     
  20. Orren

    Orren Member

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    Yes, they're blank. But who cares, they're on a different track.

    Here's an entire scenario:

    1) You record a guitar track called "Killer Riff." It comes out perfectly, except that second chorus into the bridge, that you sorta blew the timing.

    2) Place your playhead at the beginning of the area you want to fix. Hit the command-T to Split your audio right before your mistake. Then place the playhead at the end of the region you want to fix. Hit command-T to split the region again. You now have made a separate region for your mistake.

    3) Create another track immediately underneath, called "Killer Riff blunders." Drag your mistake to this track. As you can imagine, if you make numerous mistakes, you can add as many regions as you want from the above. Now you have your original track with the error on it, and a new track with your blunders.

    4) With "Killer Riff Blunders" selected, hit M to mute the track. If you want to hear your previous audio while recording the new audio, skip this step.

    5) Create a track named "Killer Riff fixes" and follow my instructions in the post above (post #3930230) to record the new audio.

    You have now re-recorded your fixes, while not actually removing any mistakes permanently. This way if you decide later on that even though your fix is technically perfect, you prefer the feel of the original sloppier take, you still have it muted on the "Killer Riff Blunders" track.

    Again, it takes longer to write out than actually do, when you get used to it. The advantage of using a more complex program like Logic is that after you split the regions, you can then mute the individual blunder region. But GarageBand doesn't allow individual regions to be muted, AFAIR, only tracks. So something like Logic allows you to do the above more elegantly, but I still would recommend doing it this way, rather than punching in. Keep in mind, "punching in" was originally designed to save tape and tracks, back in the days when we didn't have nearly endless storage. You can be sure that if tape machines back in the day had hard drives attached, they wouldn't have been punching in nearly as much!

    Orren
     

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