What effect is that?

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by Tinman, Dec 28, 2005.


  1. Tinman

    Tinman Member

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    This is probably a longshot for a response, but... does anyone know what kind of effect is being used on Fastball's "Fire Escape"? It might be the same type of effect used by Jerry Garcia on "Casey Jones". Anybody? Anybody? Buehler?
     
  2. nashvillesteve

    nashvillesteve Member

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    Sounds like the phasing from a Leslie cabinet, or it could be a similarly-set uni-vibe or other chorus/phase unit, maybe some delay as well (I'm listening to "Casey Jones"). I bet the Dead probably used everything. Probably also wet and dry amplifiers being used. Sounds like a compressor might be in there as well... I'd be willing to bet that there is at least one Leslie cabinet on the slow setting in the guitar mix somewhere, or at least a phaser/vibe unit of some sort.
     
  3. leofenderbender

    leofenderbender Supporting Member

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  4. Tinman

    Tinman Member

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    Thanks Steve. Your theories match with mine, but I've never been able to reproduce the sound. I've never tried the wet amp/dry amp thing though. Nor have I tried adding compression. I'll try your suggestions.

    I know what an auto wah does. Thats not the effect that I'm inquiring about.
     
  5. nashvillesteve

    nashvillesteve Member

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    An envelope filter/autowah can create a sort of "attack" or swirl, which is awesome, but I don't think that's what's on the Casey Jones track. Having wet/dry amps is cool, essentially your sound is a different kind of blend than just being able to control the wet/dry blend of an effect into one amp. Kind of the ultimate parallel effect mixing. I am still needing some more cables to hook everything I have up, but I am excited, as I have a couple of stereo effects (Deluxe Memory Man, the switching system has several discrete and unique signal lines that can be mixed together, future Red Witch Deluxe Moon Phaser). What is interesting is that one of my amps is driving a Leslie cabinet, so I'm wondering what the phaser will sound like when either the wet or dry output is sent through a Leslie and the other is not (I'm going to have Loooper build me a box that will swap the wet and dry outputs from the Moon Phaser when I get one). Also, that same amp has an effects loop with an E-H POG and a weird compressor that makes the guitar sound like an organ through the Leslie, I should be able to get some pretty weird combinations. When I get it all going, I will post sound samples of what the different parallel combinations sound like.
     
  6. cameron

    cameron Member

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    You can use a Mutron to dial up a sound that really isn't an auto-wah. With certain setttings it doesn't do that distinct wah-ish sound, but just adds some kind of extra swooshy effect. I used to play years ago with a guitarist who used a Mutron in this way. He used to say that the Mutron "has a mind of its own" and he liked the unpredictable swooshy sound he got.

    Mr. Garcia most definitely used the Mutron for its wah qualities, but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if it were there on the studio recordings doing something else. The sound in question might involve more than just the Mutron, lots of possibilities already listed, but the Mutron might well be part of it.
     
  7. nashvillesteve

    nashvillesteve Member

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    There very well could be an envelope filter/mutron of some sort on there, not necessarily set to an auto-wah sound, but to more of a filter changing the sweep and attack (like an envelope controlled phaser type sound, bringing us closer to the other previously-mentioned effects).

    I have an Emma Discumbobulator on my list- a great mutron type pedal.
     
  8. wgs1230

    wgs1230 Fully Intonatable Silver Supporting Member

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    1. The MuTron Envelope Filter didn't actually exist when "Casey Jones" was recorded (Mike Beigle filed the patent claim in '73 and it was granted in '75- http://www.mu-tron.org), and Garcia didn't begin using one 'til the mid-70s.
    2. There are 3 base electric guitar tracks on that recording- clean left, clean right, leslie center (plus Garcia's clean solo overdub), and it's possible that the leslie guitar is Weir, not Garcia- that tone is heard in the first, low-register solo break, and most transcriptions credit BW with the part.
     
  9. Tinman

    Tinman Member

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    I'm learning a lot here. Thanks everybody. The sound I hear in my head is like a Hammond through a Leslie, but not just the rotating speaker effect. There's also an organ-like quality to the guitar tone itself apart from the swoosh of the rotation.
     
  10. nashvillesteve

    nashvillesteve Member

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    well, like I said, I haven't heard the Fastball track and am only going by Casey Jones, but this type of effect and double stop licks with one note moving and one note fixed create a sort of organ vibe. This is the main type of lick I use when emulating an organ, the overtones and juxtaposition of the notes create a cool sound, and many classic organ licks feature a figure with one voice moving and one fixed. The same goes for pedal steel type licks, but for organ emulation, you must minimize vibrato, attack and anything that sounds "in-between" two pitches (like bends).
     
  11. BrianB

    BrianB Supporting Member

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    There's a lot of studio air in Casey Jones on Workingman's Dead but I think Jerry is just playing slide, in the main solo at least. He was experimenting a lot with pedal steel at the time. I think Phil's bass and Bobby's guitar have the leslie on them. When they played it live it actually had quite a similar feel, just with how they play the chords and how they interact.

    If you listen to Candy Man off American Beauty, that came out just after Workingman's Dead you can hear a more obvious use of leslie. Although it's on pedal steel, on the album track, in the later '70s and so on Jerry used a MXR Phase 100 to get the sound live.
     
  12. Cap'n Fingers

    Cap'n Fingers Member

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    I might be off base here since I'm going by memory on the sound you're talking about but; Phase Shifters were pretty popular back at that time. I had an old MXR phase shifter that made great swooshing sounds.

    -Mike

    (edit) Just saw BrainB's reply above. I guess my memory wasn't too far off. :)
     

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