What overdrive will turn my BF Deluxe into a Tweed Deluxe?

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by straightblues, Feb 10, 2006.

  1. straightblues

    straightblues Member

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    Title says it all. I want tweed tones out of my blackface deluxe and bassman amps. What is the best overdrive to achieve this?
     
  2. jpagey

    jpagey Supporting Member

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    Clark Gainster
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  3. fast ricky love

    fast ricky love Supporting Member

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    I think I might be interested in something like that too... what kind of difference would that make exactly to the tone of the Deluxe Reverb?
     
  4. straightblues

    straightblues Member

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    I have the Clark Gainster on order. It should be here next week. Any others that I should consider???
     
  5. Unburst

    Unburst Member

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  6. Guinness Lad

    Guinness Lad Silver Supporting Member

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    Think about the eq curves between the two amps; Deluxe reverb more high-fi, reduced mids, more bass and treble, and less sag. Tweed deluxe, more mids, less and treble, generally a little darker sounding and more sag due to the 5y3 rectifier.

    The classic tube screamer type pedals generally come to mind, the only thing I would want is something that isn't too bright. You would want something with more compression because the tweed deluxe definitely compresses the tone. The Fulldrive Fulldrive on the "Vintage" setting is a good starting point although this pedal does have more low end then most tube screamer type pedals.
     
  7. meterman

    meterman Member

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    Menatone Working Mans Blues (JTM45) and Dirty Blonde might do the trick too...
     
  8. sstweed

    sstweed Supporting Member

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    I hate to be the stick in the mud, but I have been playing a Blackfaced Deluxe Reverb for 10 years now. Gone through dang near every pedal talked about on this board and then some. This last month I bought a Mission amps tweed Deluxe kit. I am going to be shunned for saying this on a pedal board, but nothing, and I mean nothing, in a pedal sounds as amazing as a tweed. It is littlerally as though each string has its own amp. Though tweed distortion is grainy and mushy at its extreme, every string is there plain and clear. No pedal comes close. They don't have the texture and they don't have the separation. That said, of all the pedals I tried that even came close, the Blackstone OD comes closest to matching the feel and texture. If massaged correctly a Ge fuzz will get you there in a fuzzy sort of way. The DR will always be the wrong timbre. Too bright and piercing. I got a lot of miles out of lowering the preamp tube voltage. Measure that if you can. If it is over 200V or so, change out the power supply dividers, and get that voltage down to 175 - 190V. That warms the amp up a lot. Roll the treble back, and snip out the treble bypass cap. Get a warm speaker like some of the Webers. I have a Blue Dog ceramic in mine, but even Ted C12N's are warmer than the stock board of fare. These are some of the things I tried in an attempt to get a warmer sound out of my Deluxe. I didn't even realize I was looking for a tweed sound until I got the Tweed though. But now that I have that amp, most of my BF/SF amps might be for sale. Nothing sounds like the glory that is tweed, except tweed. Certainly nothing in a silicon powered pedal.
     
  9. Macaroni

    Macaroni Member

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  10. fr8_trane

    fr8_trane Member

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    If you really want to get as close as possible I would suggest having a good tech perform these MODS to your amp:

    Cathode Bias/ fixed bias switch installed where your ext spkr jack is.
    Tweeds were cathode biased. This will make your BF deluxe lose a little power but the amp will get squishier with less bass and treble and a slightly more midrange tone. This will get you closer to the tweed feel.

    and/or a

    Mid Boost using a push pull pot on the treble control to increase the value of the treble cap. This will add even more mids and reduce the upper treble. Used by itself this mod will actually make your amp slightly louder and is basically like the mid boost feature found on Dumble type amps and some older Mesa Boogies.

    and/or a

    gain boost using a push pull pot on the bass control to add series resitance to the midrange resistor. The midrange cap shunts ALOT of gain to ground by increasing its value you can return the gain to the signal. A value of 25 K will give you about 6db of volume boost with more gain and more bass, mids and treble for a raw tone. This is equivalent to the RAW control on the Allen amps. You can get a similar effect by installing a special pot on the vibrato control that bypasses the vibrato circuit when its turned to minimum.

    and/or a

    Negative feedback control where the ground switch is. Basically there is a fixed feedback resistor that will be replaced by a pot allowing you to dial in the desired amount of FB. Most tweeds had less NFB than their BF counter parts. This results in earlier breakup and a smoother transition into distortion. This will only work if you have had a 3 prong cord installed on your amp (you have, haven't you? safety first).

    All of the mods are completely reversible (hold on to the original parts) and will allow you to dial your amp for either the original BF tone or a PSEUDO TWEED tone. A competent tech should be able to do all of these mods for about what you'd pay for any BJF pedal.
     
  11. straightblues

    straightblues Member

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    I agree with your statments. I really love the sound of my BF amps for 90% of what I am doing. I just want a pedal for that other 10% of the time.
     
  12. straightblues

    straightblues Member

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    I have the mid boost gain in it already. I may check out the other mods you mentioned. However, I don't want to loose my Black Face tones so I will be really careful whatever I do.
     
  13. mad dog

    mad dog Silver Supporting Member

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    Straight:

    I've played a BFDR for years, more recently own and play tweeds. The DR can launch many very cool tones, but it will never be mistaken for tweed. My favorite OD with the DR happens to be the Clark Gainster, not because it makes it tweedy, but since it is so subtle and matches perfectly with the DR's voicing. By all means give it a shot. Me personally, I've learned to seek out and use amps for the things they do best. Plus, I use pedals sparingly if at all. No way around multiple amps for me. The mod route is appealing only if you're really dissatisfied with the the basic character of your amp. It doesn't make sense to me to mess with the 90% utility of the amp to get the other 10%.
     
  14. drbob1

    drbob1 Silver Supporting Member

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    One of the hard things about pedal distortion (even tube based units) is that the breakup tends to come on more abruptly and get harder faster. That is, a cathode biased amp with a marginal OT and power supply transitions from sort of clean to dirty very smoothly. I've not found ANY pedals that will do that. Once you're into distortion, a lot of different things will give a tweedy kind of distortion-you need something with more mids, less bass and a smooth character-a TS9 derivative is pretty close to perfect. But for that transition territory, I don't know...
     
  15. sstweed

    sstweed Supporting Member

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    Amen. Right amp for the right job. My new credo. The fewest pedals possible to get the job done. BF style amps definately have their place. I love them. I hate seeing them butchered to sound like Marshalls or tweeds (I know no one is suggesting that here, but I have seen it in other places). A used tweed Deluxe clone (Clark, etc) will run less than $1k if you shop, kits are even cheaper. They are easy to lug around and sound like heaven. If you are like me you will go through a grand worth of pedals trying to find the right one for this sound, and then never be totally happy, even for that little 10%. Want a tweed, get a tweed. You will get immediate gratification, and probably save money in the long run IMHO.
     
  16. OOG

    OOG Member

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  17. straightblues

    straightblues Member

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    You are right. I have been against pedals for a long time. I currently have 9 amps. I just don't have a tweed. I truely do love my BF Fenders, I have a 1966 Champ, 1964 Deluxe and a 1965 Bassman. I have spent a lot of time trying to match the right size amp for the right gig so I don't have to use an overdrive. However, sometimes it doesn't allways work out so you need pedals for those nights. What I really need is a 12 watt amp to fill in between the Champ and the Deluxe. I will be buying a Tweed Deluxe clone.

    Having said all this, I still need an overdrive for the nights I miss it and I would like that overdrive to have a tweed flavor. I hope the Gainster does it for me.
     

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