Which Chinese 12AX7s for my Shiva?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by Lution, Oct 10, 2006.

  1. Lution

    Lution Member

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    Looking to pay for the regular Chinese tubes, nothing NOS to go into the first 4 spots on my Bogner Shiva head.

    Basically, it would be the C9 I believe.
    Will Ruby tubes do the job?
    Is Shuguang tubes the right ones? Are they the same thing? Which ones do I avoid?


    Thanks

    -Lution
     
  2. reaiken

    reaiken Member

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    I like the Ruby 7025HG for the first preamp position in high-gain amps and the 7025SS for the rest of the positions.

    Randall Aiken
     
  3. devbro

    devbro Member

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    Thery're labled "chinese". If you call Bogner, they'll tell you where you can get them. I think I ordered some from ARS in Van Nuys. BTW, I put some Tung-sol 12ax7's in my Shiva and they soundmuch "bigger".
     
  4. bluesmain

    bluesmain Member

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    Lution,

    I just got a shiva too and I was looking at back up tubes (spares). From the bogner site questions link-
    What kind of tubes? Is a re-bias neccesary?[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Matched sets of Svetlana power-tubes must be used in ECSTASYS and SHIVAS, [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]UBERSCHALL amps must use matched Tesla power-tubes. As always [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]biasing these tubes is a good idea for optimum tone. Svetlanas hold up well to our high voltages and sound great. [/FONT]

    If you find a source drop me a message as I want to get a back up set.

    Johnny
     
  5. Lution

    Lution Member

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    Hey Randall. Thanks. Will Fat Willie know what I'm talking about if I give him those numbers?
     
  6. Lution

    Lution Member

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    That's what I'm running currently... and it sounds pretty good, just hearing that all-chinese is best in the Shiva. I have a Ruby 12AX7 in v1, then Tung-sol in v2-v4 then EH 12ax7s in the fx-return slot and the PI slot.

    Can you tell me what differences you have heard between the chinese and the Tung-sols in your Shiva?
     
  7. Miles

    Miles Member

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    I would prefer JJ's for any amp. Chinese and sovteks have given me a really tough time and they sound tinny and brittle in comparison at louder volumes. Whereas the JJ's stay smoother and more full all around. But I have never tried different tubes in Bogners, so I could be off
     
  8. reaiken

    reaiken Member

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    Yes, he should know them. You may also want to look into the Tung-Sols, as others are suggesting. I haven't tried them myself, but I hear nothing but good things about them. I would probably recommend sticking with the 7025HG in the first preamp position, though, as it would likely be less microphonic than the longer-plate Tung-Sols. I find the Chinese tubes to be a great combination of low microphonics and "open" tone. They sound much better and more detailed to my ears than the JJ ECC83s I used to use.

    RA
     
  9. Blue Strat

    Blue Strat Member

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    The Tung Sol Reissue 12AX7s are one of the best new production performers in microphonics and tone.
     
  10. AJ Love

    AJ Love Senior Member

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    I've only tried JJ 12AX7's in a few applications, but I really don't like them very much at all, they are too bright, not detailed, not smooth. I even like Groove Tube Sovteks better than JJ's, which is saying something
     
  11. jamison162

    jamison162 Member

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    I agree with the above post about JJ's. My favorite 12ax7's are Tung-Sol and Ei. Have not tried any EH. Ruby's & Groove Tubes are just relabeled.
     
  12. loudgtr

    loudgtr Member

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    Speaking of re-labled (from the post above) what exactly are the Groove Tube 12AX7C? Which Chinese tube I mean? the 8th or 9th generation? I think I've read that the 9th gen. are a bit better. Not sure though.
     
  13. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater Supporting Member

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    The JJ ECC83S is the smoothest, most detailed 12AX7 I've ever encountered.
     
  14. loudgtr

    loudgtr Member

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    In my best Dr. Evil (I think that's the bad guy from Austin Powers) voice: "Really . . . and have you encountered them all?"

    Seriously though, current production I mean. :BEER
     
  15. Dave_C

    Dave_C Member

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    I highly recommend giving the Tung Sols a try. They were clear winners over the Shuguang in everything from my Maz 18 to Hot Cat 30R to Fuchs TDS-50. The only only amp that preferred something else (Svetlana no less) was the Allen Accomplice.
     
  16. Lution

    Lution Member

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    I'm already using the Tung-Sols in my Shiva. Sounds very good, but the Chinese is what Reinhold recommends.

    I've got some C9 tubes ordered from Lord Valve. I'll probably mix them with the Tung-Sols when they arrive.

    fun!!
     
  17. devbro

    devbro Member

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    I tried many pre amp tubes in my shiva including NOS and the only thing better than the stock Chinese were Tung-sols. The Shiva clean channel is why I bought the amp and the Chinese tubes brought out the "shimmer" that I sought. The Tung-sols not only had the shimmer but also were more articulate and reactive to pick attack. The Shiva is a pretty compressed amp probably due to the plate voltage running across the power section (550V) so the more responsive sounding Tung-sol's were quite musical. Also, they added what was missing from the gain channel - sparkle.
     
  18. BobboVisMe

    BobboVisMe Member

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    Chinese 12ax7's SUCK !!!!!!!!!!!!! :moon Get some NOS Telefunkens or Mullards .... and you'll be saying ahhhhso Bobboson !!! If your looking to save $$$$ try the Ei Telefunken smoothplate copies !! I wont use anything but European tubes..
     
  19. Guinness Lad

    Guinness Lad Silver Supporting Member

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    Too bright, maybe the long plate tubes but the short plate tubes are probably the darkest current production tube you can buy. I can't believe the Bogner site say's you have to use matched Svetlana pre-amp tubes, I've never heard any amp manufacturer ever say this. I like the new Tungsols and the c9 shugnangs.
     
  20. reaiken

    reaiken Member

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    That's good to know. What kind of percentage yield do you get on them? Do they compare to the Chinese or JJ's in terms of microphonics?

    Thanks,

    RA
     

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