Why do th recent year PRS guitars lose so much value?

[TheLastMaya]

Not just PRS. Even other brands. I've seen gibson and fender custom shops 50% their original price and still not selling. So yeah, it's probably the economy.

 

[73Fender]

Well, I waded through this thing over several days while waiting for my first PRS. Interesting.

I was never tempted by them for some reason. Even when GC had their blow out. I play Fenders (+ a Kirn and a Legacy G&L), Gibsons, Heritages, Hamers and a Gretsch so mostly traditional styles.

Then a nice guy on another forum posted a natural finish Korina McCarty from 2007. Brazilian RW board, one piece body, wide fat neck. Not blingy except for the naturally beautiful wood and those birds. Caught my eye for some reason. Watched it and watched it over several weeks, almost traded for it but couldn't part with the trade guitar. After a while and a price reduction into my comfort zone (pretty flippable if I don't bond), I bit.

Will be here tomorrow. I'll let you guys know what I think. Looking forward to it, never even picked one up before. One of those "need to try one someday" brands for me.

 

[Jon Silberman]

No surprises here - unless available in limited quantities exceeded by the current demand, all consumer goods lose a hefty part of their value immediately upon initial purchase.

 

[73Fender]

No surprises here - unless available in limited quantities exceeded by the current demand, all consumer goods lose a hefty part of their value immediately upon initial purchase.

And that's why, except for the occasional manufacturer blow out, I buy my guitars pre owned.

This is somethiong like the one I got but mine is a one piece with much nicer and circular grain..nice and understated IMHO.

 

[Elduderino73]

Maybe too many people in the used guitar market are turned off by the flashy finishes and don't want bird inlays.

 

[stealthtastic]

They are mass produced guitars that are marketed as being boutique. There is nothing boutique about them. I've owned 10+ US made CU24s and 2 Private Stocks. Buying them as collectable instruments is...naive to say the least.

 

[Jon Silberman]

They are mass produced guitars that are marketed as being boutique. There is nothing boutique about them. I've owned 10+ US made CU24s and 2 Private Stocks. Buying them as collectable instruments is...naive to say the least.

Curious if you've ever been on a tour at PRS?

 

[Flogger59]

Curious if you've ever been on a tour at PRS?

I have been in several factories, and some of the places where the lower priced instruments are made the amount of handwork that goes into even these is astounding.

Yamaha's old Taiwan facility was an eye opener. They were doing OEM for Takamine at the time, and I Was expecting an automated cookie cutter spitting out guitars at one end. So not the case. On the standard dry cleaner's chain (all factories use these to transport unfinished guitars from station to station, except maybe Gibson) you would see every SKU possible, mixed up all higgledy-piggledy. Dreads, Jumbos, classicals, Yamaha, Takamine, they were all mixed up, as well as colours. I was expecting to see a mile of one model being done at a time, but they were making everything, all the time.

Binding put on by hand, frets by hand, dovetail joints fitted by hand, sprayed by hand. On a guitar that would retail for $349.00. In comparison, Fender was highly automated, as was Peavey way back when.

Yes, PRS are mass produced, and in a fairly standard way.

 

[Jon Silberman]

I have been in several factories, and some of the places where the lower priced instruments are made the amount of handwork that goes into even these is astounding.

Yamaha's old Taiwan facility was an eye opener. They were doing OEM for Takamine at the time, and I Was expecting an automated cookie cutter spitting out guitars at one end. So not the case. On the standard dry cleaner's chain (all factories use these to transport unfinished guitars from station to station, except maybe Gibson) you would see every SKU possible, mixed up all higgledy-piggledy. Dreads, Jumbos, classicals, Yamaha, Takamine, they were all mixed up, as well as colours. I was expecting to see a mile of one model being done at a time, but they were making everything, all the time.

Binding put on by hand, frets by hand, dovetail joints fitted by hand, sprayed by hand. On a guitar that would retail for $349.00. In comparison, Fender was highly automated, as was Peavey way back when.

Yes, PRS are mass produced, and in a fairly standard way.

Based on my personal experience, wrong, but not worth an argument.

 

[Flogger59]

Based on my personal experienc

Based on my personal experience, wrong, but not worth an argument.

'Splain, please.

 

[stealthtastic]

Curious if you've ever been on a tour at PRS?

No and it doesn't matter. I'm not saying they aren't nice. I'm saying they are mass produced, which they are because I can find one at almost any store or online easily. They aren't rare/boutique instruments at all. Buying a new PRS and thinking they will be collectors items that will go up in value is hilarious as they are a dime a dozen. If you want your guitar to go up in value and want it to be a PRS, then a prefactory with braz is your best bet. Like the poster above me said, they are made just like most guitars. There isn't special magical mojo behind them. It's just a result of strong branding and marketing --- which is something they've done really well.

 

[hackenfort]

Over saturation and way way to many limited editions.

My general rule - new at least 60% off MSRP. And used has to be even a better deal. Unless it's something I really want.

 

[smcgov]

It was mentioned earlier but I think a typical PRS buyer is much more interested in a new , mint instrument. There is no iconic worn, beat, relic'd PRS universe which is so common for Fender and Gibson.

 

[Jon Silberman]

'Splain, please.

PRS guitars have a huge amount of American hand labor in each one. PRS is excellent at using machines for what they excel best at - cutting woods to 1000th of an inch specs, though even then, the selection of the wood and placement of it in the CNCs itself is an art - and having humans perform the rest. Now this is not the same as having a single person build your entire guitar from beginning to end but even that's rarely the case anymore with any but the smallest builders. What you get with the USA PRSi are essentially team-built guitars with tons of hand labor and personal attention. To me, that's not radically different from the typical team-built boutique guitar.

 

[griggsterr]

I have been in several factories, and some of the places where the lower priced instruments are made the amount of handwork that goes into even these is astounding.

Yamaha's old Taiwan facility was an eye opener. They were doing OEM for Takamine at the time, and I Was expecting an automated cookie cutter spitting out guitars at one end. So not the case. On the standard dry cleaner's chain (all factories use these to transport unfinished guitars from station to station, except maybe Gibson) you would see every SKU possible, mixed up all higgledy-piggledy. Dreads, Jumbos, classicals, Yamaha, Takamine, they were all mixed up, as well as colours. I was expecting to see a mile of one model being done at a time, but they were making everything, all the time.

Binding put on by hand, frets by hand, dovetail joints fitted by hand, sprayed by hand. On a guitar that would retail for $349.00. In comparison, Fender was highly automated, as was Peavey way back when.

Yes, PRS are mass produced, and in a fairly standard way.

Same for me, I have watched guitars produced by hand, I have seen them assembly line (cookie cutter) built.
neither one necessarily produces a better instrument. While it's really wonderful to watch a skilled craftsman, a CNC robotic machine can do many of the same things, with more accuracy, consistency and way faster. To buy guitars for investment purposes, just like any investments takes product and market knowledge. market knowledge being the most important. Gibson sells more guitars in a year than PRS, and will certainly almost always sell more unless some really stupid decisions are made, and they are certainly capable. Gibson and fender both sell guitars, the same reason Shure sells 58's and Smith and Wesson sells handguns, and Harley sells motorcycles. That reason being, Pride of ownership. One time I let a buddy of mine play my Don Grosh Hollow retro classic T he played it for a couple of gigs, and went on and on about what a great guitar it was. but later when he was giving it back to me he said it was a wonderful guitar, but it had a long way to go to beat a Fender. To him the fact that he had a real Fender guitar was the big deal. My $3400 Grosh to him (since he didn't know anything about boutique guitars or even guitars in general really) was just a knock off. IF you are buying guitars to invest in, I would buy the things that I knew I could turn in 6 months or less at a profit. there is no way to predict what the market will look like in 5 or 10 years/ And in 15 years I doubt we will have half as many guitar players as we do , if you haven't listened to what the 13 -20 year olds are listening to there are almost no guitars, and if they are there, they were sampled and looped.

 

[hackenfort]

It was mentioned earlier but I think a typical PRS buyer is much more interested in a new , mint instrument. There is no iconic worn, beat, relic'd PRS universe which is so common for Fender and Gibson.

I must say my best sounding PRS I have is an older one that someone loved and played the heck out of it for years. It's got some serious players wear, but feels and sounds great. And it has the old T&B pickups so many pulled out and replaced.

I do hope PRS doesn't create a "Relic" line of guitars.

 

[Flogger59]

PRS guitars have a huge amount of American hand labor in each one. PRS is excellent at using machines for what they excel best at - cutting woods to 1000th of an inch specs, though even then, the selection of the wood and placement of it in the CNCs itself is an art - and having humans perform the rest. Now this is not the same as having a single person build your entire guitar from beginning to end but even that's rarely the case anymore with any but the smallest builders. What you get with the USA PRSi are essentially team-built guitars with tons of hand labor and personal attention. To me, that's not radically different from the typical team-built boutique guitar.

I think that we basically see eye to eye on this point,the differences being in costs of labor and materials. The processes, however, are quite similar.

 

[AudioWonderland]

Minor threadjack...I was talking to a local shop owner who's a dealer for a pretty exclusive high-end brand. He's got the "stock" models coming in pretty regularly, and has moved some of them. He told me he's going to start ordering some custom models. I told him that he'll likely never sell them at full price - reason being that if I know that there is an option out there to build my dream guitar, and I've been playing long enough to know what I like in woods and dimensions, his chances of hitting my "dream" guitar by pulling random options off the list are slim to none.

I told him I'd likely come in, play his $4K+ custom model, then have him order the one I would have speced in the first place. Eventually someone will take his custom guitar, but he'll likely take a bath on it.

I feel the same way with all of these dealers taking random shots in the dark with the PRS Private Stocks. If I'm dropping that level of cheddar, it's going to be what I want, not what Dave's Guitar wanted....

/end threadjack

But if that one display model serves as the catalyst to sell 12-15 guitars then he probably ends up doing ok.

 

[AudioWonderland]

Good points. In both cases I believe that the PRS SE and G&L Tribute lines contribute significantly to the brands and account for a significant portion of their sales.

In PRS's case 2013 production was (as quoted by Forbes) projected at:

MD, USA: 13,000
Korea: 25,000

And lets face it, PRS makes no profit from used guitar sales. If the SE line lets them compete at a lower price point against their own product in the used market then good for them. That's just good business.

 

[AudioWonderland]

Generally, the thought is that a cheaper version that carries the same name will devalue all products carrying that name to an extent. Like if Ferarri came out with a model that cost $25,000. The thought is that if you reduce the exclusivity of an expensive product you also reduce the desirability.

I'm not making a judgement on whether or not it is true but that is usually the hypothesis floated by people.

Epiphpne has not hurt Gibson any.