Why Fuchs amps are cheaper than other D-style amps?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by blue reverend, May 11, 2019.

  1. blue reverend

    blue reverend Member

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    Hi,

    I'm looking for a Dumble style amplifier I and am about to order a Fuchs ODS Classic 50. Unfortunately I don't have the possibility to try out a Fuchs or another D-style amp. I am about to choose a Fuchs because of the soundfiles and videos I found on the internet and because the ODS is affordable for me. Fuchs amplifiers are certainly not cheap, but they are significantly cheaper than other US or european competitors (Two Rock, Bludotone, Amplified Nation, Van Weelden…). I wonder why that is. I know that Fuchs amps are not point to point wired. Is that the only reason? Or do I have to make compromises with a Fuchs in terms of tone or built quality. Or are Fuchses simply honestly calculated amps without mojo factor surcharge?

    I am very interested in your assessments and experiences.
     
  2. Darkness

    Darkness Member

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    Marketing.

    You’ll find the same with tweeds. A builder like Jim at Little Dawg builds stellar amps for fair prices. Other builders build stellar amps with inflated prices.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2019
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  3. FenderBigot

    FenderBigot Supporting Member

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    D-style for your first post? Very TGP of you! :aok
     
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  4. Jon Silberman

    Jon Silberman 10Q Jerry & Dickey Gold Supporting Member

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    Eschewing PTP eliminates a lot of hours of labor. For a US builder, that's huge.

    And FWIW, though I'm hardly a D-amp connoisseur, I have played through two actual Dumbles and several clones. I liked the ODS Classic 50 I tried the best of the bunch. It's truly a special amp. On days like this, I wonder why I, too, haven't already bought myself one.
     
  5. big mike

    big mike Plexi Loving Admin Staff Member

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    Very very very good pcb construction
     
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  6. glenngross

    glenngross Supporting Member

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    Andy Fuchs posts here on occasion and very well may respond here. I’m far from a D style expert, but the production cost advantage may have something to do with it. I’d encourage you to contact Fuchs. They’re very responsive to inquiries. I have a new BlackJack 21, which shares some DNA with the higher end ODS Classic. It’s one helluva grab and go amp. I doubt if you could go wrong. Having said that, I’d love to hear it next to my Two Rocks an Ceriatone OTS (bought them used). :aok
     
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  7. BearBryan

    BearBryan Member

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    Who is building PTP Dumbles? Sounds like an incredibly time consuming and expensive undertaking.


    P.S. I know what you meant. Just giving you a hard time.
     
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  8. voodoosound

    voodoosound Funk & Grooven member Silver Supporting Member

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    If price is a concern even cheaper and equal or better than Fuchs. Get a Sebago or even a Ceriatone.
     
  9. gulliver

    gulliver Supporting Member

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    Welcome to tgp. If you include your city in the post, it can be helpful.

    There are often Fuchs D amps on the Guitar Center Used site, it's only $30 for shipping and you get a 45 day return policy. You might see others, like Sebago or Ceriatone, as listed above, but you'd really have to look over a long period of time.

    Looking for Excellent condition might be best, sometimes they'll list a real dog as great or good condition.

    Of course, the Fuchs-built amps and Fuchs modded amps are two different things. The modded amps will be cheaper, but you may need to try a few before scratching that itch.
     
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  10. Festus

    Festus Supporting Member

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    There are no comprimises in tone or build quality with a Fuchs amp. I have a Fuchs ODS Classic 50, and it’s become my #1 amp. I’ve been using it week in and week out for over a year, and it’s solid. I’ve been through a number of Dumble clones and D-style amps, and I prefer Fuchs.

    American Music Supply and Zzounds stock most of the Fuchs line, and they have a generous return policy, so there’s very little risk in ordering an amp from those retailers.
     
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  11. DiPa

    DiPa Constant GAS Silver Supporting Member

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    There are many here that own Fuchs amps, hang on and you will get some valid responses. I have also seen Fuchs here many a times, so you may be in for a treat.
     
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  12. blue reverend

    blue reverend Member

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    Thanks. Ok I should have said handwired instead of point to point, right? But that is also inaccurate I think because there is some wireing by hand in PCB-Amps too. There seem to be PTP D-style amps. The Real Guitars RG 80 (German Dealer, Dutch manufacturer) is PTP handwired without curcuits boards for sure. Two Rocks speak on their website of their 'hand-wired, point-to-point- excellence'. But I'm not sure if they mean PTP in the strict sens (without curcuit board)
     
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  13. blue reverend

    blue reverend Member

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    Thank you for all your answers and support. I am from Germany and have chosen TGP because D-style amps are a topic here. In Germany there are only one or two dealers who offer some US-D-style-amps. There's no Fuchs dealer in Germany. I'd have to order the ODS classic in Holland. Sebago amps are not available in Germany (thanks to glenngross for the tip). I already contacted Andy about another question but in this case I would like to hear the opinion of other musicians.
     
  14. voodoosound

    voodoosound Funk & Grooven member Silver Supporting Member

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    If you're in Germany. Talk to Peter Van Weelden or Steen Skrydstrup. We have a twinkleand and an OD50. I'd take either one of those over any Dumble "copy" type amp out there except for Bruno of course. And both Peter and Steen will taylor an amp to your liking. Second to that track down a kittyhawk that's been cared for.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2019
  15. snoop335

    snoop335 Member

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    I‘m in the same boat: Living in Germany, there is not that many options to spot a nice boutique D-Style clone. I chose to ask Gary from Glasworks to build me a customized Zingaro and have it shipped to Germany.

    Of course this means buying without testing upfront. Plus it‘s crazy expensive considering the cost for shipping and import taxes. Also, I can only hope that the amp will arrive in one piece. Returning it for what ever reason is not an option. Still - After reading every single post about Glaswerks and the Zingaro I simply couldn‘t resist. I decided not compromise on a single option, rather „make it right“, no matter if this would add another 100 bucks to the bill.

    Going though my requirements list with Gary in multiple interactions, I’m now confident to have it spec’ed to my liking. Luckily, I‘m at a stage in my professional career that allows me to take the remaining financial risks. Now that the order has been placed (last week) I‘m eagerly waiting like a kid before Christmas. I consider this excitement to be a part of the package I pay for.

    So, I guess what I try to say is: Go for what you really want after you digested all available info on the internet. Don‘t go for cheap (if you can afford) or compromises, in particular if you can‘t check out the gear before buying. There is high risk that you will be disappointed. You don‘t want to end up asking yourself what would have happened if you would have bought the dream rig, do you?

    Best of luck with whatever decision you take. And keep us posted...

    Cheers - Snoop
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2019
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  16. Fuchsaudio

    Fuchsaudio Member

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    E-mail us, I believe Distinctive Guitar in Germany imports our products.
     
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  17. Fuchsaudio

    Fuchsaudio Member

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    An awkward question indeed. I feel like the question really should be “why are so many other d-style amps so expensive”? . This is especially confusing if someone basically makes a clone that takes very little real “designing”. Or if they are a home-based builder without the overhead of a factory or employees.

    Look, I honestly feel that we offer an outstanding value in terms of features, build quality, customer support and of-course sound. We’ve got as healthy an endorser list as many of our competitors, maybe even better. Our product reviews have been great, despite a minimal amount of advertising.

    I’ve played and/or serviced (or been asked to modify) many amps from many of the “grail” amp makers mentioned here on TGP often. A few even asked for technical and design assistance. “Wow, what did you do, that customer was thrilled..”. No, I won’t embarrass them.

    It makes me wonder maybe if we charged more it might make people take our products more seriously ?

    From making our amps the same size footprint (for cabinets and packing cost advantages), sourcing all our iron and speakers from the same vendors, sharing some chassis components and many electronic components and sub-assemblies throughout the lineup, we’ve controlled our costs and try to use those efficiencies to give us a market advantage. We stopped wasting money on local amp shows and took a break from namm too. We simply try to make a fair profit for what we sell. Operating a busy repair shop (which subsidizes our overhead), helps a bit too.
     
  18. Serious Poo

    Serious Poo Powered by Coffee Gold Supporting Member

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    I own a Fuchs ODS 50, it's one hell of a great amp.
     
  19. Oriondk

    Oriondk Member

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    The first time I heard of Fuchs and heard one of your amps was a demo that Paul Reed Smith did of a PRS McCarty. I fell in love with that sound. I’m just a bedroom player so it’s hard to justify an expensive amp, But I’ve been looking for a tube amp and really like what I’ve heard from the Blackjack 21. My budget was going to about $1,000 but now I’m thinking I’ll just save a little longer and go with that.
     
  20. JackD

    JackD Gold Supporting Member

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    I have some of the more expensive PTP D-style amps you mentioned and have also tired a Fuchs. I don't own a Fuchs, but have some friends (who I respect) who one them. All I can say is Andy makes an excellent product. I also think for the money, they are a really great value.

    In the end, you really can't go wrong with any of the builders you mentioned in your initial post. If it makes you happy to buy a more expensive amp, go for it. If you can try a Fuchs and you like it, that is great--buy one. In any event, you will be in great shape to go out and make music!!
     
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