Why the copyright trolls have won YouTube

Discussion in 'The Sound Hound Lounge' started by TonePilot, May 27, 2020.

  1. splatt

    splatt david torn / splattercell Gold Supporting Member

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    the answer is: people.
    if you feel you're not getting paid enough for your contribution, try
    1) negotiating for more (& Union) payment (viz. residuals, which can become fairly substantial),
    2) talking to either the artist in control or whomever is paying you, if you've got nothing to lose but the gig.

    many session players feel fine about simply raising their pay-scale, etc.

    all of the above kinda presumes that the sessioneer is not requesting more so they can disingenuously drive a personal money/power-grab, but because they actually know what they're contributing, re: an original part that colors & alters the arrangement sufficiently enough to be considered writing. (i'd say that, normally, that's someone who understands the sense of "ownership" that very often accompanies writing original material).
    but their abilities to be self-critical, ethically aware & knowledgable enough about music & music rights oughta be fine-tuned-enough to avoid money/power-grubbing due to overblown and/or "entititled" views they may have of themselves.

    again: many session players feel fine about simply beginning to raise their pay-scales (& thereby residuals, etc.), when they become somewhat indispensable to a musical employer who's doing (or might do) "hot business", sad-lol.

    ymmv.
     
  2. CassetteTape

    CassetteTape Member

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    People forget or don’t realize that with any Google or Facebook services, you are the product.
    Remembering that helps put all of this into the right context.
     
  3. BillyJacked

    BillyJacked Member

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    James Taylor doesn't want his ex-bassist playing James Taylor music.
    Taylor owns his music, he decides how it's presented, used, etc. Guess what? That's fair, that's the law.
    Nine pages in, the problem is this - People are mad they can't rip off other people's creative content.
    Thieves...thieves everywhere.
     
  4. Gilbert Rocks

    Gilbert Rocks Member

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    Amen to this. I am a music teacher and the first thing I tell my students is stay away from Youtube. What a bottom less pit of nothing but noise and more noise. I will admit I got pulled in for a bit by a bunch of the content, and then I was like, what am I doing? All of that time goes into playing my instrument and learning my craft. Nothing more satisfying than becoming a more accomplished artist through nothing but your own hard work. Keep on creating not regurgitating...see what I did there. lol.

    Cheers!
     
    Ed DeGenaro and I am the Liquor like this.
  5. tktk

    tktk Member

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    Yeah, because those videos are to promote his products. His channel wasn't huge until he started What Makes ~ series. Maybe he had 100k or so.
     
  6. griggsterr

    griggsterr Supporting Member

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  7. griggsterr

    griggsterr Supporting Member

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    You are one in 500 guitar players maybe one in 1,000. maybe one in 5,000. That can fluently read sheet music. If you started on Violin I would totally expect that.
    The old joke, If you want to get a keyboard player to turn down? Take his music away from him. Want to get a guitar player to turn down? put some sheet music in front of him. :)
     
  8. tktk

    tktk Member

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    :confused::confused::confused:
     
  9. tiktok

    tiktok Supporting Member

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    You don’t need to be able to sight read it for it to be useful.

    Plus, arguing that “I can’t be bothered to learn to read—give me things for free” isn’t compelling.
     
    donm1104 and Korla Pundit like this.
  10. twotone

    twotone Member

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    Visual instruction works best for me. I need to see where the hands are on the fretboard because there are many places where the same notes can be played. YouTube is a great place to get guitar lessons. :)
     
  11. Korla Pundit

    Korla Pundit Member

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    I'm terrible at sight reading complicated stuff at fast tempos, but I learn pieces from notation. I also put almost everything I write into notation. It's much quicker for me to re-learn something old or re-start work on something I'd put aside from reading than trying to figure out what I did on a scratch recording.
     
  12. -sku-

    -sku- Member

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    Are not all youtube people promoting something in one way or another? The reason he is promoting his products is because he's basically creating educational videos for you to watch for free. All the money from those views go to the IP owners. Isn't it fair for him to get something back when he basically gives views and advertisement to the IP owners for nothing in return?
    One simple test is for you to setup a youtube account and see if you can get to 2 million subscribers by just playing copyrighted material alone.
     
    John Hurtt likes this.
  13. Scary Uncle G.

    Scary Uncle G. Member

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    I took guitar lessons via sheet music 50 years ago but wouldn’t call myself a “sight reader.” I read music at about a “first grade” level when I have to, such as church choir (I also sing), or music lessons.

    For most of my life I worked with other musicians who didn’t read so reading wasn’t much use. Still, if you can both read AND play by ear/improvise, there will be a lot more doors open to you.
     
  14. griggsterr

    griggsterr Supporting Member

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    I'm not arguing, I'm with you. I'm not certain where the line is but too much has been given out for free. But buying sheet music isn't going to be a path that any modern combo musician will ever take. You think guitar players can't read or read charts (which they cannot) try drummers.
     
  15. griggsterr

    griggsterr Supporting Member

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    I can easily read a chord chart. Which is more than 97% of all guitar players. I would also guess that I know more theory and more about how to use it than 97% of guitar players.
     
  16. TonePilot

    TonePilot Supporting Member

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    You can. Remember when Kennis Russell had his channel hacked? The hackers put up pirated movies. Had several million subs inside two weeks.
     
  17. -sku-

    -sku- Member

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    Straw man argument. We are discussing about videos which automagically get demonetized before even being available to the public.
    That we are talking about a legal way of posting copyrighted music is implied by the topic of this thread.
     
  18. Scary Uncle G.

    Scary Uncle G. Member

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    My mother was a classically trained pianist so she made sure I had some theory behind what I was doing so I could transpose songs to different keys, come up with bass lines or arrange songs for the band. ;)
     
  19. MikeMcK

    MikeMcK Silver Supporting Member

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    Yeah, the textbook example of this is the Verve's Bittersweet Symphony... we all know little bits of the story but Jagger and Richards got paid big bucks for a part they never wrote and may actually have never heard, at least until it became controversial.

    In the '60's record companies would squeeze every last drop of profit from a hit by doing two things: 1) Christmas versions and 2) instrumentals that could work in a dentist's waiting room. When the Stones had a hit with "The Last Time" (which Keith has said several times was adapted from the Staples Singers' "This May Be the Last Time"), Stones producer Andrew Loog Oldham hired arrangers and studio musicians to do the instrumentals marketed as the 'Andrew Oldham Orchestra'.

    Oldham hired an arranger named Tim Whittaker to come up with an orchestral version of The Last Time and this record is what The Verve sampled for Bittersweet Symphony. Tim Whittaker came up with that part, there's no question about it, and in '66 the Stones were probably not even paying attention to the sappy string versions of their songs.

    But Tim Whittaker didn't get paid by The Verve... neither did the musicians who played it, nor Andrew Oldham, who commissioned it, nor Pops Staples, who had at least as much to do with it as Mick and Keith did, simply because the basic song was credited to Jagger & Richards.

    Hey, if musicians got paid for creating the riffs that made the record, the world today would be owned by Hal Blaine, Carol Kaye and Tommy Tedesco.
     
  20. TonePilot

    TonePilot Supporting Member

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    You said “setup a YouTube account, play copyright material and see how many subscribers you can get”. So I post a factual and recent example. Just because you didn’t expect that answer doesn’t make it less valid.
     
    tktk likes this.

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